Federal Election Talk, Monday, May 2, 2011 (3)

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NorthReport
Federal Election Talk, Monday, May 2, 2011 (3)

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Issues Pages: 
NorthReport

Jack's doing fine so far.

NorthReport

Liberals march to distant beat of Tory drummer

 

 

http://www.thestar.com/article/962481--hebert-liberals-march-to-distant-...

NorthReport

Liberals march to distant beat of Tory drummer

 

 

http://www.thestar.com/article/962481--hebert-liberals-march-to-distant-...

Lens Solution

Tory candidate lobbied for firm selling F-35 jets

 

A Conservative candidate in Ontario lobbied for a firm that is selling Canada a fleet of controversial fighter jets whose disputed cost helped spark the election, the Toronto Star has learned.

Raymond Sturgeon, who is trying to unseat the New Democrats in the northern Ontario riding of Algoma-Manitoulin-Kapuskasing, had a long and distinguished career in the Canadian Forces both as a soldier and civilian, before taking up his most recent position.

 

http://www.thestar.com/news/canada/politics/article/962525--tory-candida...

NorthReport

No one believes Iggy on coalition issue: Poll

 

http://cnews.canoe.ca/CNEWS/Canada/CanadaVotes/News/2011/03/28/17776691....

NorthReport

Ignatieff hoisted on his own petard in Quebec

 

http://www.theglobeandmail.com/news/politics/second-reading/brian-topp/i...

NorthReport
alan smithee alan smithee's picture

I'm getting tired of MSM using quotations when reporting on Duceppe calling the King a liar.

Harper is not 'lying'.

Duceppe has the proof on paper and there's even news archives as it was reported in 2004.

Harper isn't 'lying'...Harper is lying.

And he's been caught redhanded.

The campaign is 3 days old...It looks like Duceppe was ready for a fist fight and so far he's been landing some quality punches.

I hope he continues...I'm feeling confident that he will.

NorthReport

If he was lying Harper would have sued Duceppe by now. And if at a certain point it this starts to cause Harper major grief it was not surprise me to see Harper lauch a legal action against Duceppe just to try and get him to be quiet about their back room deal in 2004. Cons have deep pockets for that type of thing.

alan smithee alan smithee's picture

Yeah..That isn't out of the realm of possiblity...That would be a text book Tory response.

But there is a problem for Harper if he tried to launch legal action.

Duceppe is making these statements with written PROOF.

If anyone should launch legal action,it should be the Opposition.

The Tories use attack ads without proof..With doctored quotations,lies and half truths.

Let Harper make this into a legal issue...Not only would he lose the case but alot of other things,bigger and more destructive things would be brought out into the open.

Duceppe has Harper on the ropes with this...Hopefully it will resonate with some people living outside of Quebec.

KenS

I was putting myself in the shoes for a minute of an Ontario Liberal MP, most of whom are in 2 way races with the Cons.

Iggy's narrative about it being a choice between Harper or the Liberals does nothing for those MPs looking to be re-elected. Stating the obvious is not a ballot question for you.

Not going to be hearing grumbling when people are in the middle of campaigns, but they cant be very happy campers.

Anonymouse

Michael Ignatieff and his impossible dream. See 1:30 of the first video.

NorthReport
David Young

First M.P. Derek Lee bails on the Liberals, and now  M.P. Raymonde Folco, Laval-Les Iles, has decided not to re-offer.

Rats deserting the sinking Liberal ship?

 

gyor

According to ndponline and the ndp.ca iggy is once again targetting ndp ridings instead conservite. First Ottawa Centre then, then Outremont, and Trinity-Spadina. Wow isn't he a threat to stephen harper. The NDP is rightly making fun of him. To be fair someone.has got to fight the extreme reactionary neo conservatism of...OLVIA CHOW! mwhahaha.;p what a coward that man is.

NorthReport

Help Ignatieff find Conservatives

Aristotleded24

gyor wrote:
According to ndponline and the ndp.ca iggy is once again targetting ndp ridings instead conservite. First Ottawa Centre then, then Outremont, and Trinity-Spadina. Wow isn't he a threat to stephen harper. The NDP is rightly making fun of him. To be fair someone.has got to fight the extreme reactionary neo conservatism of...OLVIA CHOW! mwhahaha.;p what a coward that man is.

What if the NDP loses both its Toronto seats but does very well nationally, while the Conservatives tighten their grip on the GTA? I'd love to see Iggy's reaction to that.

NorthReport

Quote:
Duceppe: If you're going to use rhetoric, use the right rhetoric

 

 

At a campaign rally on Sunday, the Bloc candidate for Marc-Aurèle-Fortin, Marie-France Charbonneau, embarked on a similar verbal rampage against the Conservative leader and included the line: "Stephen Harper's only obsession is to get a majority so he can impose his extreme-right agenda, his ultra-conservative agenda."

When asked about this afterward my reporters, Duceppe was frank.

"I spoke with Marie-France and told her to talk about a populist-right, a retrograde-right, reformist - something like the Tea Party."

Gentle as it may be, it was a surprisingly frank, public rebuke of a candidate by the leader.

Especially after Duceppe, at the same event, spent some time ridiculing Gary Goodyear, the Minister of State for Science and Technology, who is said to believe in Creationism.

"He thinks everything was created in six days, that Darwin was wrong," Duceppe continued.

"These people believe, this minister believes that the Flintstones was a documentary."

http://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/inside-politics-blog/2011/03/duceppe-if-...

NorthReport
Anonymouse

The money quote for me from the Parlons QC article is this: ""Harper is trying to play on an anti-Quebec sentiment," Duceppe said of the prime minister's insistence the minority Liberals would form a "separatist-socialist coalition" with the Bloc and the NDP this time."

Now that this is out of the bag, the NDP can echo it and set up an even bigger division between itself and the other federalist parties.

alan smithee alan smithee's picture

The Conservatives sound more desperate than confident.

First,they say that if they were to win they wouldn't change the existing budget that they tabled that wasn't passed.

Now they are promising a huge tax credit contingent EXCLUSIVELY in the even of a Conservative majority win.

First you're going to lie about not touching the current budget and now you're blatantly trying to BRIBE the electorate.

Jesus Christ,why such a hard time to decimate these pricks?

They've been proven to be LIARS and HYPOCRITS and now they are proving that they are also solidly partisan and have been reduced to bribing Canadians by holding out a carrot that will only be available upon a majority win.

Are Canadians that STUPID?...Are Canadians that easy to screw?..Probably.

I'm not even bothering with anything happening outside of Quebec..It's becoming clear that a Harper majority will not happen with the participation of Quebec.

And if there is a Harper majority WITHOUT scoring one in Quebec,the wheels will be in motion as sovereignty could then be sold because of the Conservative policies following a majority win.

It will be time for Harper to prove he supports the 'Quebec Nation' by handing Quebec all the power to govern themselves.

But Harper is a proven liar...There will be a Constitutional mess unlike what we've seen in the past.

Aristotleded24

alan smithee wrote:
Now they are promising a huge tax credit contingent EXCLUSIVELY in the even of a Conservative majority win.

It's more than that, it's contingent on Harper winning at least the next two elections.

NorthReport

Harper has really pushed Duceppe's buttons, because he is really going at Harper today like I have never seen anyone ever do.

Incroyable.  Laughing

alan smithee alan smithee's picture

Aristotleded24 wrote:

alan smithee wrote:
Now they are promising a huge tax credit contingent EXCLUSIVELY in the even of a Conservative majority win.

It's more than that, it's contingent on Harper winning at least the next two elections.

The next Two elections...

Aye Carumba.

I hope Canadians can't be bought off that easily...and I don't remember a more sleazy and slimy federal government in my lifetime.

Boom Boom Boom Boom's picture

CBC did a short but excellent coverage of Layton in Saskatchewan just before noon my time. Excellent speech, I wish the network carried the whole thing, but then they broke away to carry part of Duceppe's speech which was on at the same time. Duceppe was announcing his campaign theme.

NorthReport
wage zombie

KenS wrote:

I was putting myself in the shoes for a minute of an Ontario Liberal MP, most of whom are in 2 way races with the Cons.

Iggy's narrative about it being a choice between Harper or the Liberals does nothing for those MPs looking to be re-elected. Stating the obvious is not a ballot question for you.

Good point.  If there is a blue door, and there is a red door, then the choice is about what colour of paint Canadians prefer.

Lens Solution

alan smithee wrote:

The Conservatives sound more desperate than confident.

How do they sound desperate?  If they're well ahead in the polls right now and Ignatieff isn't moving up, I don't think they have much to feel desperate about.

alan smithee alan smithee's picture

Not desperate?

That's why they went back on their word of keeping the budget as is if they won the election and have reduced themselves to BRIBING the electorate with money but ONLY if they win a majority or the offer is off the table.

That sounds like desperation.

If they were so confidant they wouldn't have to resort to bribes and if their record and policies were so popular they'd run on those 2 things instead of relying solely on fabricated ' fear' and  attack ads that,for the most part,are libelous.

Duceppe is doing a masterful job of contradicting Harper and exposing him as a liar and hypocrit.

Will this resonate with people outside of Quebec?..Maybe.

But this could throw a wrench in the Tory's hopes of gaining support in Quebec.

But we're 3 days into the campaign so it's WAY too early to know exactly how things are going to come together..We can only speculate right now.

But atleast Duceppe is exposing cracks in the Tory ivory tower....And that's a REAL positive.

 

Lens Solution

The incumbent government always has the potential advantage of adding in additional goodies to sweeten the pot, so that doesn't mean Harper is desperate.  He is also claiming that the tax cut will not come until after the budget is balanced in a few years, so he will claim he is not changing the current budget - this is for a future budget.

It's good Harper has a strong opponent in Quebec like Duceppe, but even there the Cons still have support.  It's not as if the Cons are in single digits in Quebec, whether we like it or not there is still a minority of Quebecers who are supporting the Cons, and they are still going to win seats there.

Hopefully some of the Cons anti-Quebec rhetoric will get back to Quebec and hurt them.

gyor

wage zombie wrote:

KenS wrote:

I was putting myself in the shoes for a minute of an Ontario Liberal MP, most of whom are in 2 way races with the Cons.

Iggy's narrative about it being a choice between Harper or the Liberals does nothing for those MPs looking to be re-elected. Stating the obvious is not a ballot question for you.

Good point.  If there is a blue door, and there is a red door, then the choice is about what colour of paint Canadians prefer.

that made me laugh, an election on door paint.

Jack attacked Harper on the HST, Scandels, and healthcare so for and has confirmed Harpers attempted coalition.

alan smithee alan smithee's picture

Lens Solution wrote:

 

Hopefully some of the Cons anti-Quebec rhetoric will get back to Quebec and hurt them.

 

I think in the end,you can count on it.

Duceppe has not only attacked Harper for being a liar but he has ridiculed their social conservatism.

I can't speak for the rest of the country but I've lived in Quebec all my life.

I know alot people,many do not share many of my values or ideas and some of my friends identify themselves as ' conservatives'

The difference between them and the Harpercons is that their conservatism is chiefly on the economy..Some of them support the military missions.

But I have never met a Creationist in my life and as conservative as some people I know are,they do not support alot of the social conservative crackpot policies.

Duceppe is armed with alot of artilery and he is using it.

So far he has painted Harper as a habitual liar,an ideologue and the Conservative Party as a wingnut Creationist fringe.

He can still start to attack Maxime Bernier who has publicly stated his desire to kill bill 101 and Duceppe,(unlike Ignatieff),is very influencial,an excellent debater and an excellent speaker....Even leagues better than Harper.

The Bloc website is selling themselves as the only party that can stop a Harper majority and I strongly agree with their claim.

Lens Solution

alan smithee wrote:

Lens Solution wrote:

 

Hopefully some of the Cons anti-Quebec rhetoric will get back to Quebec and hurt them.

 

I think in the end,you can count on it.

Duceppe has not only attacked Harper for being a liar but he has ridiculed their social conservatism.

I can't speak for the rest of the country but I've lived in Quebec all my life.

I know alot people,many do not share many of my values or ideas and some of my friends identify themselves as ' conservatives'

The difference between them and the Harpercons is that their conservatism is chiefly on the economy..Some of them support the military missions.

But I have never met a Creationist in my life and as conservative as some people I know are,they do not support alot of the social conservative crackpot policies.

Duceppe is armed with alot of artilery and he is using it.

So far he has painted Harper as a habitual liar,an ideologue and the Conservative Party as a wingnut Creationist fringe.

He can still start to attack Maxime Bernier who has publicly stated his desire to kill bill 101 and Duceppe,(unlike Ignatieff),is very influencial,an excellent debater and an excellent speaker....Even leagues better than Harper.

The Bloc website is selling themselves as the only party that can stop a Harper majority and I strongly agree with their claim.

As I said above though, while I think the Bloc is probably the best-positioned to stop Harper from winning a majority, obviously they cannot stop Harper from picking up seats outside of Quebec.  No one party can beat Harper in every riding.  The NDP needs to do it in some ridings, and there are actually some ridings where the Liberal is best-positioned to beat the Cons.  It's a very complicated situation.

But what I would like to know is why are the Cons still polling around 20% in Quebec?  It looks like they are only vulnerable in about 2 or 3 Quebec ridings.  They need to lose about 5 or 6 in Quebec to prevent them from getting a majority.

alan smithee alan smithee's picture

I don't buy the 20% projection and if Duceppe keeps the offensive up,I imagine that that 20% will shrink a little.

And if that percentage was to fall,it would not come as a gain for the Libs or NDP...It would be a Bloc net gain.

I'd like Duceppe to create some wedge issues in Quebec..If he hasn't thought of it already,I hope it enters his mind soon.

Painting a threat to Bill 101,culture and values could work.

Again,it's way too early to call.

I'm clinging on the hope that with the Liberals dead in the water,the majority opposition will be the NDP and the Bloc.

And I think Ignatieff believes in that possibility.

I'm convinced that Iggy has dismissed forming a coalition government because he wouldn't be the leader of it if it were to materialize.

Lens Solution

Pundits Guide reports that former Derek Lee aide, & former pres Canada-India Council, Rana Sarkar to run for Liberals in Scarborough Rouge-River

 

http://twitter.com/punditsguide

Pogo Pogo's picture

Isn't there something inherently wrong to offer an election promise only if you are elected.  If an expenditure or tax break makes policy sense, in most cases it will make sense regardless of who is in government.  If you believe in the HST then does it matter who impliments the program?  To remove support for an issue based on how many people vote for you is the worst kind of blackmail.

NorthReport

Coalition negotations take place after the election not before.

Lens Solution

Conservative group advertising on Craig's List for writers who will post pro-Harper rhetoric around the Internet:

 

http://i.imgur.com/757PM.png

alan smithee alan smithee's picture

So the new Tory strategy is to hire trolls to infiltrate social media sites?

I said it a few posts back but I'm going to repeat it.

I don't ever remember a federal government more sleazy and slimy in my lifetime as the Harper Conservatives.

Maybe I'll apply and sabotage the bastards.

alan smithee alan smithee's picture

NorthReport wrote:

Interesting.

Harper's Canada doesn't include Quebec

 

 

http://fullcomment.nationalpost.com/2011/03/28/tasha-kheiriddin-harpers-...

 

Quick...Send this to Gilles ASAP Tongue out

NorthReport

Interesting, these Cons think they can do no wrong, and easily keep power. Just wait till we put our coalition into effect on the nite of May 2nd. Laughing

But keep it secret till then ok.

Harper's Canada doesn't include Quebec

 

 

http://fullcomment.nationalpost.com/2011/03/28/tasha-kheiriddin-harpers-...

NorthReport

Speaking of.....

 

I just love this guy, he's fantastic.

 

Bloc could support - but not join - Liberal coalition, Duceppe says

 

 

http://www.montrealgazette.com/news/Bloc+could+support+join+Liberal+coal...

Doug

Which throws Michael Ignatieff a nice anchor.

JKR

alan smithee wrote:

So the new Tory strategy is to hire trolls to infiltrate social media sites?

I said it a few posts back but I'm going to repeat it.

I don't ever remember a federal government more sleazy and slimy in my lifetime as the Harper Conservatives.

Maybe I'll apply and sabotage the bastards.

Hiring trolls to infiltrate media sites?

Making election "promises" that might take effect two elections away from now, if the budget is balanced?

This is by far the most surreal election I can remember.

Harper and the Cons have no moral compass whatsoever.

This election is becoming less and less about Harper and the Cons and more and more about how much Canadians are willing to ignore.

Duceppe seems to be the only one able to show us that the emperor is naked.

gyor

That might have been an achor if iggy had promoted the idea of a coalition, but he attacked it, this will just fuel harpers attacks and send iggy on the defensive.

gyor

That might have been an achor if iggy had promoted the idea of a coalition, but he attacked it, this will just fuel harpers attacks and send iggy on the defensive.

Lens Solution

I'm not sure if it will put Ignatieff on the defensive.  By answering "no" to a coalition, the media is not going to bug him about it as much and there's more opportunity for Ignatieff to focus on going after Harper.

Some of the media may get fed up with Harper bringing up the coalition issue every day and they may start challenging Harper on other topics.  I just watched Don Martin's show on CTV and he said he is sick of hearing about the coalition.

KenS

Tom Flannagan, who was Harper's Chief of Staff in 2004 is saying that it does not just look like that letter to the GG was about forming a Conservative led minority government- that was indeed the point.
Oops!
Prime Minister Stephen Harper on Monday denied allegations by the NDP and Bloc Quebecois leaders that he was working on a plan with them in 2004 that would have made him prime minister without a mandate from Canadian voters.
"I do deny it," Harper told journalists at a news conference on the third day of the federal election campaign. "Just as Mr. Duceppe and Mr. Layton denied it clearly at the time."
.....
They also held a news conference and Harper made statements which critics now say appeared to suggest he was ready to form a government, with the support of the other two parties, without going to the polls. Harper's aides said Sunday that is a misinterpretation of what happened, adding that Harper merely wanted the governor general to refuse Martin an election if he asked for one, so he would be forced to work with opposition parities.
On Sunday, Layton and Duceppe said that's not true. They said Harper was clearly trying to work out a deal with them that would result in him becoming prime minister without the need for an election.
But Harper said that's not true.
"What was the option? The option was very clear. It's the option we did, which was as Opposition leader, I was seeking to put pressure on the government to influence its agenda without bringing it down, without defeating it and replacing it."

Lens Solution

Another good thing is that earlier today CPAC aired the complete footage of Harper talking to reporters with Layton and Duceppe in 2004.

The Cons have threatened that they will keep showing photos of Layton and Duceppe together from 2008, but now people are beginning to see the 2004 footage of Harper himself with Duceppe.

Boom Boom Boom Boom's picture

It's wise to remember that Harper's first two budgets were passed with help from the BQ.

excerpt from here:

Later Duceppe explained that since the 2004 election, when the minority Liberal government of Paul Martin was elected and the two following elections in 2006 and 2008, both ruling parties – Liberal and Conservative – have turned to the Bloc for support. “The first two Harper budgets passed because of support from the Bloc,” he recalled.

I find it odd that Harper has such disdain for the BQ when they helped his budgets get passed. I hope the reporters following Harper around remind him of this fact.

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