Who should the NDP choose as an Interim Leader?

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Mr. Magoo Mr. Magoo's picture

Shall we give it a week?

Or what?  I'm just trying to see the relevance of this thread.  Apparently, Tom VOWED.  What if he doesn't take his vows lightly?

nicky

A small reminder of what we are giving up:

http://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/mulcair-house-wherry-1.3532848

 

NorthReport

I presume the entire Caucus will decide who will be leader until the leadership convention.

quizzical

nicky wrote:
A small reminder of what we are giving up:

">http://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/mulcair-house-wherry-1.3532848

Quote:
And when the Speaker called on the member for Outremont to ask the sixth question of the afternoon, Mulcair was acknowledged with a standing ovation, not merely from his typically peppy caucus, but from Conservatives and Liberals as well, a seemingly unanimous expression of appreciation.

A politician is never more easily admired than in defeat or retirement. And probably no one appreciates the politician quite like another politician. Rejection, it might be noted, stalks them all.

"Mr. Speaker, after years of ethically challenged Conservative rule, the Liberals promised to do things differently," Mulcair began when everyone had returned to their seats.

The Conservatives theatrically groaned in jest. Mulcair laughed. Liberals stood to applaud.

"The minister of justice is doing certain things differently," the NDP leader continued. "When Conservative minister Shelly Glover was caught holding a dodgy fundraiser in 2013, she promptly gave the money back. However, this minister refuses to do the same.

"Will the prime minister ask his minister of justice to simply give the money back?"

The prime minister defended his government and Mulcair moved on to other suggestions of shortcomings. "The Liberals swore they would be different," he said, "but they keep finding novel ways of being the Liberals."

Unionist

NorthReport wrote:

I presume the entire Caucus will decide who will be leader until the leadership convention.

No. Mulcair remains as leader unless he decides to step down. If that happens, National Council, in consultation with caucus, appoints an interim leader.

Debater

jjuares wrote:
Debater wrote:

I don't remember Chantal Hébert commenting on the number of people expected at the Convention.

As to the main point, I think she is right that had Mulcair called a leadership contest earlier on, he could have competed to win his own job again.  A few folks here on Babble were even suggesting that he do something like that.

What Hébert is saying is that compared to the other leaderhsip contenders, he would have been the strongest candidate (eg. the one with the most experience, the most fluent in both official languages, etc.).

You don't remember Chantal writing about the number of delegates expected?!. The link is below. And by the way, and this really is funny. You are the one who originally posted the link.Do you even read the shit you post?
">http://www.thestar.com/news/canada/2016/04/10/writing-was-on-the-wall-fo...

Yes, I do read the articles I post.

I guess that number wasn't something that stood out for me from the article.

I think Hébert is referring to the original number that was expected a number of months ago before it became apparent that a larger number of people would be attending than originally expected.

Her point still stands:  the larger than expected number of people who registered reflected the fact that many of them were motivated to oust Mulcair.

jjuares

Debater wrote:

jjuares wrote:
Debater wrote:

I don't remember Chantal Hébert commenting on the number of people expected at the Convention.

As to the main point, I think she is right that had Mulcair called a leadership contest earlier on, he could have competed to win his own job again.  A few folks here on Babble were even suggesting that he do something like that.

What Hébert is saying is that compared to the other leaderhsip contenders, he would have been the strongest candidate (eg. the one with the most experience, the most fluent in both official languages, etc.).

You don't remember Chantal writing about the number of delegates expected?!. The link is below. And by the way, and this really is funny. You are the one who originally posted the link.Do you even read the shit you post?
">http://www.thestar.com/news/canada/2016/04/10/writing-was-on-the-wall-fo...

Yes, I do read the articles I post.

I guess that number wasn't something that stood out for me from the article.

I think Hébert is referring to the original number that was expected a number of months ago before it became apparent that a larger number of people would be attending than originally expected.

Her point still stands:  the larger than expected number of people who registered reflected the fact that many of them were motivated to oust Mulcair.


No her original point has been shown to be the claptrap it always was. There were 1900 in Montreal and that wasn't a leadership vote. The rest of the media was reporting that 1500 were to be expected. There was a slight increase. The 900 number that she glommed onto was never taken seriously by anyone. It is called managing expectations. Indeed the press reports compared the 1770 registered to the 1500 expected. And of course
all one had to do was to consider the venue. I have attended about 40 different functions at the Shaw including 25 professional conventions. 900 would have produced an embarassing empty looking room. I know her gravitas is impressive. But really. There was a slight increase not double. Facts matter.

Caissa

This thread should be closed for lack of relevance. As long as we have a leader, discusion of an interim leader is moot.

josh

The thread is not who is the interim leader, but who should be the interim leader.

terrytowel

Today is the weekly caucus meeting and the NDP has BANNED the media from waiting outside the meeting room. Just like the Conservatives used to do.

No wonder Conservatives liked Mulcair.

Notalib

This is not only "relevant" it is essential the NDP deal with issue ASAP.

The path the NDP is on now, much like I said after E-Day, is devolving into a very serious siutation.

The longer Mulcair defies reality and clings to the leader's office the faster the spiral of devolution will evolve.

An Interim leader is the appropriate course of action. One with a simple mandate of ensuring a neutral leader's office in the stick handling of the leadership convention, while also steadying the party and working to open it up for renewal versus clamping it down and turtling as seems to be the case now.

A big part of the problem is the leader has no credibility and therefor cannot speak with any authority on the future of the party and as result cannot be taken seriously on not only party affairs but issues of the day.

We all know that those who have long exercised dominance in the party feel that continuing to do so despite the full flat out rejection embodied in both the recent election and the convention vote is business as usual and no one within the party can take them on with any effect. However if the NDP wants a future it has to end the long established power paradigm, first by removing the leader and replacing him with an interim neutral leader and then by designing a leadership contest that can offer real renewal removed from those who have brought the party to where it is.

Those folks have a home in Alberta and should stay there while the party works to become relevant again throughout the rest of the country.

Otherwise the party risk simply being sucked in the blackhole that is Alberta politics.

 

 

jjuares

terrytowel wrote:

Today is the weekly caucus meeting and the NDP has BANNED the media from waiting outside the meeting room. Just like the Conservatives used to do.

No wonder Conservatives liked Mulcair.


Oh, come on. Is this the first time that the NDP have done this? This going to be an emotional meeting. It's incredibly churlish for you to make this comment.

NorthReport

Who would be the best interim leader from Quebec?

terrytowel

jjuares wrote:
terrytowel wrote:

Today is the weekly caucus meeting and the NDP has BANNED the media from waiting outside the meeting room. Just like the Conservatives used to do.

No wonder Conservatives liked Mulcair.

Oh, come on. Is this the first time that the NDP have done this? This going to be an emotional meeting. It's incredibly churlish for you to make this comment.

I believe so, even after their crushing defeat, they didn't ban reproters outside their first caucus meeting since the election, What happened to doing things differently from the Conservatives?

terrytowel

OK so Mulcair is scruming (with the caucus behind him). says unequivocally he is staying on as leader. Mulcair says it was the most positive caucus meeting he's ever had and they asked him to stay on as interim leader. Long term goal is to be the elder statesman of the NDP (a la Stephen Lewis & Ed Broadbent)

Notalib

Where does the constitution say that after losing confidence of rhe membership on an spectacularly unprecedented scale that all that is required for the leader to stay on is a caucus meeting decision?

josh

terrytowel wrote:

OK so Mulcair is scruming (with the caucus behind him). says unequivocally he is staying on as leader. Mulcair says it was the most positive caucus meeting he's ever had and they asked him to stay on as interim leader. Long term goal is to be the elder statesman of the NDP (a la Stephen Lewis & Ed Broadbent)

As I've said, the man has no shame.  He should have made the decision and bowed out.  Not forced it on the caucus.  Also, as I've said, it wouldn't surprise me if he and his minions are plotting to use the "interim" period to get him into the leadership race.

terrytowel

josh wrote:

 Also, as I've said, it wouldn't surprise me if he and his minions are plotting to use the "interim" period to get him into the leadership race.

He was asked if he was going to stay on as an MP or even run again. Mulcair said too early to decide.

R.E.Wood

http://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/ndp-mulcair-leadership-caucus-1.3533487

NDP caucus asks Tom Mulcair to remain leader until successor is chosen

Debater

Mulcair, caucus agree he’ll stay on as leader

Quote:
After being voted out as NDP leader and blamed by NDP supporters for his role in the party’s federal election defeat, Tom Mulcair confirmed today he will stay on as party leader until a new one is chosen.

Speaking to reporters in the foyer in Parliament on Wednesday following a lengthy caucus meeting, Mulcair answered questions about his future — surrounded by NDP MP’s who applauded his responses.

“The reason I’m here is to make sure we have stability, continuity, as we prepare to have a new leader — that’s what the members decided,” said Mulcair.

The decision by caucus to ask Mulcair to serve as leader during what could be up to a two-year leadership limbo is a testament to the respect he retains among his own members as well as MPs of other parties for his skill as a parliamentarian, especially during question period.

Mulcair described the NDP’s caucus meeting as “one of the best caucus meetings we’ve ever had.” He said every single member of caucus had the opportunity to say “every single thing that was on their mind.”

He went on to say that it was “inspiring, uplifting, positive” and the result is with him today. Those comments were met by an eruption of applause from the members standing behind him.

-

Full article:

https://ipolitics.ca/2016/04/13/following-inspiring-uplifting-positive-m...

NorthReport

R.E.Wood

Thanks. This thread is now a wrap.

 

swallow swallow's picture

Notalib wrote:

Where does the constitution say that after losing confidence of rhe membership on an spectacularly unprecedented scale that all that is required for the leader to stay on is a caucus meeting decision?

Where does the constitution say that the leader has to step down? The party voted for a leadership race. Muclair accepted that decision. He remains leader until his successor is chosen. . 

Meanwhile, maybe the party can concentrate on issues other than who will be leader - so that the next leader comes in as the person charged with carrying out a policy programme developed by the membership, not as another elected supremo. 

Unionist

Notalib wrote:

Where does the constitution say that after losing confidence of rhe membership on an spectacularly unprecedented scale that all that is required for the leader to stay on is a caucus meeting decision?

Why don't you read the constitution (I know, I know, a radical proposal, but still)??

Mulcair is the elected leader of the party. Elected by the members. The caucus has fuck-all (sorry) to say in the matter. Neither does convention. Neither does the National Council. He is entitled to stay as leader until he is replaced by the next elected leader.

As for caucus, it is obvious to anyone but the Three Monkeys that Mulcair met with caucus for a few minutes after the vote, they all told him to stay, and that's what he went out and announced.

This thread is a waste of time, and a duplication of the thread about the next NDP leadership race.

ETA: Sorry, swallow, I answered before reading your post. I didn't even need to work myself up lol.

josh

Unionist wrote:

Notalib wrote:

Where does the constitution say that after losing confidence of rhe membership on an spectacularly unprecedented scale that all that is required for the leader to stay on is a caucus meeting decision?

Why don't you read the constitution (I know, I know, a radical proposal, but still)??

Mulcair is the elected leader of the party. Elected by the members. The caucus has fuck-all (sorry) to say in the matter. Neither does convention. Neither does the National Council. He is entitled to stay as leader until he is replaced by the next elected leader.

As for caucus, it is obvious to anyone but the Three Monkeys that Mulcair met with caucus for a few minutes after the vote, they all told him to stay, and that's what he went out and announced.

This thread is a waste of time, and a duplication of the thread about the next NDP leadership race.

ETA: Sorry, swallow, I answered before reading your post. I didn't even need to work myself up lol.


They all didn't ask him to stay. Don Davies went on record saying he should go. And he shouldn't have to have the caucus ask anything. He should have stepped down on his own.

NorthReport

Mulcair should have resigned election nite.

Mulcair compounded his mistake by not resigning on Sunday after the leadership vote.

Only 48% support where he needed at least 70% for goodness sakes.

If  Caucus wants the leader gone he or she is.

Folks need to be questioning why Davies is so concerned about Mulcair hanging way past his best before date.

This looks like it will death by 1000 cuts.

Mulcair staying until successor chosen, while B.C. MP questioned whether this is ‘tenable’

Departing NDP chief pledged let the new leader ‘define what I do.’

B.C. MP Don Davies said he wasn’t sure Mulcair staying on for as long as two years was a ‘tenable position.’

When approached by reporters, B.C. MP Don Davies that he expressed his position clearly on Monday: that he wasn’t sure Mulcair staying on for as long as two years was “a tenable position,” given that 52 per cent of delegates at the NDP’s Edmonton convention voted to choose a new leader.

“We had a very vigorous and frank discussion in caucus, and all opinions were expressed. And we come out of that caucus meeting united,” Davies said Wednesday.

“We’re a democratic party. Unity doesn’t mean uniformity. We have a great variety of opinions in our caucus.”

Mulcair went into his party’s Edmonton convention last week hoping to hang on to his leadership. But, in a stunning vote, 52 per cent of delegates at the convention elected to hold a leadership race, a process that could take up to two years.

NDP house leader Peter Julian said there’s a “consensus” that Mulcair can stay and that the party is “moving on.”

“A consensus is exactly that. The entire caucus is behind him,” Julian said.


http://www.thestar.com/news/canada/2016/04/13/mulcair-staying-until-succ...

 

josh

NorthReport wrote:

Mulcair should have resigned election nite.

Mulcair compounded his mistake by not resigning on Sunday after the leadership vote.

Only 48% support where he needed at least 70% for goodness sakes.

If  Caucus wants the leader gone he or she is.

Folks need to be questioning why Davies is so concerned about Mulcair hanging way past his best before date.

This looks like it will death by 1000 cuts.

Mulcair staying until successor chosen, while B.C. MP questioned whether this is ‘tenable’

Departing NDP chief pledged let the new leader ‘define what I do.’

B.C. MP Don Davies said he wasn’t sure Mulcair staying on for as long as two years was a ‘tenable position.’

When approached by reporters, B.C. MP Don Davies that he expressed his position clearly on Monday: that he wasn’t sure Mulcair staying on for as long as two years was “a tenable position,” given that 52 per cent of delegates at the NDP’s Edmonton convention voted to choose a new leader.

“We had a very vigorous and frank discussion in caucus, and all opinions were expressed. And we come out of that caucus meeting united,” Davies said Wednesday.

“We’re a democratic party. Unity doesn’t mean uniformity. We have a great variety of opinions in our caucus.”

Mulcair went into his party’s Edmonton convention last week hoping to hang on to his leadership. But, in a stunning vote, 52 per cent of delegates at the convention elected to hold a leadership race, a process that could take up to two years.

NDP house leader Peter Julian said there’s a “consensus” that Mulcair can stay and that the party is “moving on.”

“A consensus is exactly that. The entire caucus is behind him,” Julian said.


http://www.thestar.com/news/canada/2016/04/13/mulcair-staying-until-succ...

 


Don Davies has gone way up in my estimation in this process. Julian has gone way down.

Unionist

josh wrote:
They all didn't ask him to stay. Don Davies went on record saying he should go.

Ok, I misspoke. Almost everyone asked him to stay. It's so obvious that if they had said "go", he would have. My suspicion is that his inclination was to quit, but they persuaded him not to. I know him (though I disagree with almost all his political stands). Look at how he quit Charest's governing cabinet, to head into the political wasteland.

Quote:
And he shouldn't have to have the caucus ask anything. He should have stepped down on his own.

Actually - I agree. But you're missing the point. He didn't. That's why this thread is the purest waste of time. There will be no interim leader unless and until he decides, on his own, to leave. Which won't happen unless (say) caucus changes its mind, for example, after some new crisis. He's not there for his own political future right now.

 

NorthReport

Let's not be naive - as if Davies was the only one! Laughing

Julian is my choice for Interim Leader.

Mr. Magoo Mr. Magoo's picture

If this thread ever starts winding down, we should discuss which animal should be depicted on the one dollar coin.

Notalib

I remain at the head of the NDP!

NorthReport

As disenchantment contunies to grow with Mulcair sticking around as NDP leader, when he should have been a class act and resigned election nite, hopefully Caucus members will publicly voice their discontent

NorthReport

Seeds of Mulcair’s defeat sown on election day

http://globalnews.ca/news/2636789/seeds-of-mulcairs-defeat-sown-on-elect...

Notalib

Yes disenchantment is only bounnd to fester further and the devolution will continue.

I am reminded a bit of that old Monty Python clip... it works on so many levels.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zKhEw7nD9C4

 

Mr. Magoo Mr. Magoo's picture

Quote:
As disenchantment contunies to grow with Mulcair sticking around as NDP leader

Do you mean YOUR disenchantment?  Or else who are you speaking for?

Quote:
Yes disenchantment is only bounnd to fester further and the devolution will continue.

Not without our help!  This tree must be watered with regular repetitions of "disenchantment is GROWING" and "He should have stepped down!!"

NorthReport
Mr. Magoo Mr. Magoo's picture

Uh, OK.  What now?

josh


There were people who smugly dismissed the rank and file discontent with Mulcair from the election to Sunday. So it's no surprise that they would brush aside discontent with Mulcair's refusal to step down now.

Unionist

WhoM should the NDP choose as an Interim Leader?

Ken Burch Ken Burch's picture

I think the NDP should choose Unionist as Interim Grammarian.

NorthReport

I like the idea of collective leadership. 

How about any two of the following:

Ruth Ellen Brosseau, Romeo Saganash and Peter Julian.

Unionist

Ken Burch wrote:

I think the NDP should choose Unionist as Interim Grammarian.

I'm available!

NorthReport wrote:

I like the idea of collective leadership. Let's try 2 to start with.

How about Ruth Ellen Brosseau and Peter Julian.

Interim leadership? Or actual leadership? If the latter, then you're in the wrong thread.

Mr. Magoo Mr. Magoo's picture

Quote:
There were people who smugly dismissed the rank and file discontent with Mulcair from the election to Sunday.

Is this the discontent you're referring to?:

Quote:
The poll also showed that if the NDP didn’t win the most seats, 15 per cent of NDP voters said he should resign as leader.

Quote:
So it's no surprise that they would brush aside discontent with Mulcair's refusal to step down now.

It surely shouldn't be brushed aside.  It should receive approximately 15% of our attention, and use up approximately 15% of the oxygen.  If that were to be the case, I'm afraid it's used up its allotment for Wednesday, but take heart!  It resets at midnight.

terrytowel

Charlie Angus told CBC Power & Politics that with the exception of the death of Jack Layton that necessitated an interim leader, the NDP has never had an interim leader in its 55 year history. Not once, so in the NDP there is no such thing as an interim leader (Nycole Turmel notwithstanding)

Debater

That's an interesting point.

I hadn't realized that Nycole Turmel is the only Interim Leader the NDP ever had.

It sort of makes sense now that Tom Mulcair would stay on as Leader for now.

On the other hand, there's never been such a low leadership score before.

And if Mulcair plans to run for the NDP Leadership, he should declare his intentions now, otherwise it gives him an unfair advantage if he is 'Interim Leader' during this period.

Pondering

http://www.huffingtonpost.ca/2016/04/13/tom-mulcair-meets-caucus-after-b...

Tom Mulcair, the embattled New Democrat chief who has come to embody last year's bruising federal election defeat, says his caucus members want him to stay on as leader until his successor can be chosen.

Mulcair made the announcement surrounded by his fellow NDP MPs after today's caucus meeting -- their first since delegates at a convention this past weekend made it clear they believe it's time for new leadership.

He describes it as "the best caucus meeting I've ever attended."...

The NDP federal council, its key decision-making team, is expected to meet in May to further discuss setting the wheels in motion for a leadership race.

Veteran B.C. MP Nathan Cullen, a 2012 leadership contender, says he is considering a leadership bid and is discussing the possibility with his family.

The party establishment is where the Liberals were in 2011. It doesn't even cross their minds to consult with the membership. Only the opinion of the caucus and federal council is all that counts because the decisions are theirs to make.

Unionist

YAWN!

Having fun in this brain-dead thread??

NorthReport

How many months do you give Mulcair as a lame-duck leader before Caucus show him the door?

Unionist

NorthReport wrote:

How many months do you give Mulcair as a lame-duck leader before Caucus show him the door?

Tomorrow morning - 9:00 am Eastern Time.

What's your bet?

swallow swallow's picture

Mr. Magoo wrote:

If this thread ever starts winding down, we should discuss which animal should be depicted on the one dollar coin.

How about we copy the [url=http://assets.rappler.com/FDD4AE64344E4200A500B28DD11419BD/img/68D543003... Australian $5 bill[/url]? The CBC compares it to "clown puke"! 

NorthReport

The NDP's website home page right now:

All across the country, Tom Mulcair’s 
NDP team is working for you.

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