why are the tories ripping off ndp ideas

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Brachina
why are the tories ripping off ndp ideas

http://www.nationalpost.com/m/wp/news/blog.html?b=news.nationalpost.com/...

 

First there was consumer protections, then it was the rumour about Abolishing the Senate, and now there is a rumour about a possible carbon market aka cap and trade, the very thing Harper just attacked Mulcair over!

 WTF?

Skinny Dipper

I can only guess that Tom Mulcair and the NDP will be a serious threat against the HarperCons inspite of what the polls say right now.

Look for Harper to go after Mulcair on the dairy quotas.

Stockholm

Imitation is the sincerest form of flattery!

6079_Smith_W

Funniest thing was the CBC headline proclaiming that it was the NDP who were being squeezed here.

socialdemocrati...

There's something to be said for that. The NDP might be able to take credit for some of these consumer protections, but they'll no longer be able to use them as promises for how an NDP government will change things.

6079_Smith_W

socialdemocraticmiddle wrote:

There's something to be said for that. The NDP might be able to take credit for some of these consumer protections, but they'll no longer be able to use them as promises for how an NDP government will change things.

I wouldn't say that. I think they can argue it is a way in which they have already changed things. And there is still plenty more ground to cover.

 

socialdemocrati...

Frankly, now that the NDP has forced the Conservatives to set up more regulations on consumer protections, I hope that in turn forces the NDP to "cover more ground". Because bank fees, cell phone charges, and credit card interest are all appetizers, not the real meal.

janfromthebruce

I hope that Mulcair and our NDP MPs will support and perhaps amend when necessary the consumer protections that they championed. Nothing looked more silly when under the Dion Liberals when after saying they would support a anti-scab labour motion brought forward by the NDP and made it to the 2nd reading and in the end voted it down.

It was during the Harper minority govt. Topic: Dion gets booed off stage

They're chanting 'anti-scab,' reminding Dion and the Liberals of their backtracking on anti-scab legislation earlier this year.

Having supported the bill at second reading, the Liberals, complying with the wishes of corporate Canada, ultimately joined with the Conservatives to kill the bill.

This must be the middle class the new modern liberals want to support, well the non union sort.

 

Brachina

Its not Mulcair's style to be petulant over stuff like this. Mulcair has only demanded a Harper Minister resign once, I believe it was Gerry Ritz Agriculture minister.

What does one have to do with the other? Its shows Mulcair isn't petulant or childish.

Aristotleded24

socialdemocraticmiddle wrote:
Frankly, now that the NDP has forced the Conservatives to set up more regulations on consumer protections, I hope that in turn forces the NDP to "cover more ground". Because bank fees, cell phone charges, and credit card interest are all appetizers, not the real meal.

Especially when you can respond that the way around those fees is to use a credit union, keep your landline, and pay off your credit card balance on time (all of which I do).

Unionist

Harper's adoption of these gimmicks confirms what we (many of us on babble) have said all along - that they are gimmicks that change nothing, that are unworthy of a platform of a party with a history like the NDP's.

Yes, imitation is the sincerest form of flattery, Stockholm. And who flatters you should serve as a wakeup call.

 

 

janfromthebruce

I agree and which was why I was quite surprised of the long thread on cable/tv bundling. Obviously there were babblers who had lots of interest in that topic and yet banking transaction fees, some think is small potatoes.

I belong to a credit union and there are fees if I'm not at a place where my credit union is, which incidently is many places. Just saying.

socialdemocrati...

Yeah, I agree that they're small things. If I were in charge of the NDP, I'd take credit for the good ideas, proclaim yourself the most effective opposition in 30 years, and use these points to talk about the BIGGER solutions to inequality.

socialdemocrati...

At the same time... I take a look at the pages of reactions just to something as simple as TV channels. On babble, no less. In a time where the conventional wisdom is that the government can't do anything about jobs or the economy, and deregulation and privatization are always good.  For the average person who doesn't understand the economy or the powers of the federal government, these small things might be the only sign that the government is making a difference in your life. I say that with a bit of disappointment. I see my facebook feed with less political folks who were critical of Harper getting excited about changes to their TV. These small things might actually be really good politics.

Unionist

janfromthebruce wrote:

I agree and which was why I was quite surprised of the long thread on cable/tv bundling. Obviously there were babblers who had lots of interest in that topic and yet banking transaction fees, some think is small potatoes.

They're both small potatoes. That's what our political class is reduced to serving up.

You should have heard Jamie Nicholls on CBC Radio Noon Montréal just now. "They're stealing our ideas!" 

Typical narrow-minded partisan politics - which people really don't understand or appreciate.

If these are "consumerist" measures are good for people, then why not praise Harper for adopting NDP initiatives at long last? By making snide comments, Nicholls proves that partisan interests are more important than providing needed reforms.

The trouble is, or course, as we've been pointing out for years, these measures are meaningless pap. Circuses with no bread. But the NDP isn't well-placed to make that point. Not after advertising the circus for years, without any success.

I dearly hope the NDP is able to re-focus the conversation on the big issues. But it may not be possible. Curses, outsmarted again!

 

Boom Boom Boom Boom's picture

Except for me TV is a big deal, as I have it on at least six hours a day, and appreciate being able to get the variety I have at reasonable cost. If I have banking fees at my credit  union, they are very small,  and indeed I get a dividend cheque from them at the end of every year. I live on a disability pension, and these things count.

Geoff

If the Conservatives are ripping off NDP ideas, how good can the NDP ideas be?

janfromthebruce

Well Geoff, these are pocket book issues. They are small but meaningful to many people, especially people who live pay cheque to pay cheque, limited income and on pensions and disability. Also, they are important to students.

They aren't, by any means the big pieces such as closing the economic gaps but they are about the day to day.

Unionist

So why doesn't the NDP say: "Excellent! They're implementing our ideas!"

Or did they shit on medicare just because it was the Liberals who tabled the Canada Health Act?

Geoff wrote:
If the Conservatives are ripping off NDP ideas, how good can the NDP ideas be?

Nailed it.

 

janfromthebruce

Interesting but another way to think about this and a stream of tweets dealing with SH Cons using essentialy "pocket book" positions or "consumers" as they like to call it.

Ed Broadbent said that basically parties agreed on 3/4 of things but it was the 1/4 they fought about. Perhaps looking at the swiping of ideas meets what happen. And as we see, it wasn't the big ideas but smallers.

  1. Pundits' Guide ‏@punditsguide 2h

    OK, so #NDP claiming govt has put 10 of their PMBs or other policy ideas into the #SFT13. How many #LPC ideas were snatched?

  2.   Edward Wright ‏@EdWright37 1h

    @punditsguide could that not be considered a good thing when a party incorporates ideas from across the spectrum?

  3.   Pundits' Guide ‏@punditsguide 1h

    @EdWright37 Of course, it's always interesting to see one party take ideas from another when they voted against those very ideas in the past

  4.   Edward Wright ‏@EdWright37 57m

    @punditsguide suppose that would be a little to adult like. Not saying it never happens though.

  5.   Pundits' Guide ‏@punditsguide 44m

    @EdWright37 Jack Layton used to say "you can get a lot done if you don't need to get credit for it".

  6.   Edward Wright ‏@EdWright37 44m

    @punditsguide wise words indeed.

socialdemocrati...

Yeah, Jack Layton was a smart guy that way. Which is why he didn't fight the Liberals when they took up his ideas. He let them. And then he flagrantly took credit: the first NDP budget.

Unionist

socialdemocraticmiddle wrote:

Yeah, Jack Layton was a smart guy that way. Which is why he didn't fight the Liberals when they took up his ideas. He let them. And then he flagrantly took credit: the first NDP budget.

Well no, sdm, that's not exactly what happened. Layton and Martin negotiated a deal (reportedly mediated by Buzz Hargrove) to prop up Martin's minority government in the spring of 2005, which produced the "first NDP budget". It was all agreed in advance. A far cry from what happened today.

Even though there was no deal this time, I'm still amazed that Mulcair doesn't have the smarts to applaud Harper for borrowing NDP ideas (even though I don't agree with the ideas...). We'll see how this plays out.

 

 

Brachina

The NDP is bragging about how the thrown speech borrowed 10 NDP ideas, so I think that's close enough. I honestly think that the NDP didn't think the Tories would feed so deeply from the NDP's ideas, I think it came as a shock, given the idealogical underpinnings of the tories.

I think the Liberals should be worried, the NDP and the Tories are recieving plenty of attention, but for a change the Liberals are being ignored. Or maybe the Liberals have nothing to say.

Geoff

Ok, so now that the Conservatives have borrowed Liberally from the NDP trough of 'pocketbook ideas', making us Green with envy (sorry, I don't know how to fit the Marxist-Leninists in there), what's our next move?  More pocketbook micro-policies or something big enough to hang our campaign hats on in 2015?  For the sake of the party, I hope it's the latter.  And I still think if Harper is comfortable pilfering our ideas, we should be able to come up with better ones.

Arthur Cramer Arthur Cramer's picture

Brachina:

You wrote in part "Or maybe the Libeals have nothing to say".

This is a very important point. I think it is possible people are beginning to grow weary of Trudeau's lack of substance, and not willing to accept his pronouncements as revealling anything meaningul about him. It is possible that his stategy of building on some kind of imagined "chrisma", may in fact be starting to backfire on him.

socialdemocrati...

Harper has zero interest in sharing the credit, and in a majority government situation he doesn't need to.

But that shouldn't stop the NDP from declaring victory. I certainly hope that the NDP can leverage this into more, and hopefully larger victories.