H1N1

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remind remind's picture

NoDifferencePartyPooper wrote:
skepticism is always a good thing - never take anything on trust, but especially from the same mainstream corporate media that brought you Saddam's WMDs etc. etc.

 

Yes....we all know Canwest, CTV, CBC, or really any news source in either Canda or the USA, are all credible news sources for Candians!!

 

:rolleyes:

 

 

Unionist

If F. William Engdahl reports that Obama has resigned, but CTV, CBC, BBC, and AFP don't - well, I guess some of us will believe it. Not me. Guess that makes me a credulous sucker for the MSM.

Meanwhile, if an inquiry really has been launched by the Council of Europe Parliamentary Assembly, and someone can locate a source other than Engdahl (or the few fringe sites that have copied the story from him so far), please post the link here.

G. Muffin

Obama resigned?! WTF?!?  I read it on babble.  Tell your friends.

jas

Yeah, I don't see anything but the original article repeated word for word on private sites. Except it now seems to have made to the China Daily.

Here is the article in German which Engdahl cites, and here is Wodarg's home page, which Engdahl also cites. The statement on Wodarg's motion either describes the motion or is the motion itself. Either way, it states that it was tabled, not passed, with the words "The Council of Europe and its member-states should ask for immediate investigations and consequences on their national levels as well as on the international level." emphasis mine.

skdadl

Fidel wrote:

Of course, it would be no cause for concern for some of us that the WHO is accountable to no elected Parliament. Afterall, we have accountability issues with our own non-elected quasi-governmental bureaucrats for life in Ottawa. Who's keeping track? It's all good.

 

Huh? The WHO is a UN agency.

 

remind remind's picture

Am sure more info will come out about this, as if wrong tey have used a prominent European Drs name in their reports, and he would  not tolerate any wrongful use of his name I am sure. And of course the media would love to broadcast that type of story.

 

Whereas they were right there selling the "pandemic" to people, so why would they cover a story on their own possible complicity in a fraudulent action!

G. Muffin

Haven't read the article yet but I'm wondering ... who benefits from such a fraud?  The vaccine manufacturer?  Anybody else?

remind remind's picture

All the people and organizations who have stocks in said companies, Drs offices and special clinics who are paid to give shots, plus for those advocating that they should have the right to give "flu shots" too,  it is future profit making possibilities they are looking at.

 

Also, if people get attendant illnesses from shutting their immune systen down by overloading it, they go out and buy other products to make themselves "feel" better as well.  which boosts the sales of other attendant companies such as Johnson and Johnson, or even  the nose blowing  tissue industry companies.

People's supposed and real potential for sickness has become a multi billion industry, and those profitting from it fight like hell to keep the sickness industry going, as their income depends on people being sick. They do not want wellness industries, humanists and environmentalists intruding upon their revenue streams.

 

So we have things accepted  like ammonia in burger meat that causes cancer, because those profitting from cancer  and its symtoms treatments, and/or from the corporate profits of the meat packaging and selling, do not want their little investment and revenue stream worlds rocked by those advocating against such bad and humanly harmful practises.

jas

G. Pie, if you think of how much Canada alone has spent on the H1N1 vaccine -- I don't know the figure, in the hundreds of millions -- doesn't that suggest a pretty good industry for those making it?

And I don't think it's fraud as much as it is opportunism: get the WHO to declare a pandemic and governments will have to respond.

I think fraud would be if the virus was manufactured.

remind remind's picture

No that would be moving into assault and murder criminality if that was the case jas, not just fraud.

 

jas

Yes, I suppose.

Sineed

A post-mortem on H1N1 is premature, IMO.  In past years, our flu season has peaked in Feb.  Could be we've peaked early and the flu will not return, but the same climate conditions that cause our vulnerability to the flu (ie, winter) will continue for several months yet.  

So we could get a second wave, like they did in 1919, when the virus had mutated to a more virulent form.

ennir wrote:
I question this site not for those credible voices on it, and there are as Fidel pointed out, but for the other voices which seem less so, this seems an effective strategy for disinformation.

That's a good way to differentiate between reputable and disreputable sites.  The WHO, the CDC, and the Public Health Agency of Canada are reputable sites for vaccine information.  

Tigana Tigana's picture

Video release on the issue questioned above; it includes part of an interview with Paul Flynn, Vice Chair of the Council of Europe.

Flynn says that the public has been subjected to a stunt which cost health systems a great deal, enriched the pharmaceutical system, and needlessly frightened people everywhere.

"The Council of Europe will launch a probe into pharmaceutical companies accused of manipulating Swine Flu data. This follows a claim by a renowned German scientist that vaccine manufacturers pressured the World Health Organization into declaring a Swine Flu pandemic seeking to increase profits."

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t9HamW8sH8Q

Sineed wrote:
The WHO, the CDC, and the Public Health Agency of Canada are reputable sites for vaccine information.  

We shall see.

Polly B Polly B's picture

Interesting video Tigana.  (Though not surprising).

 

Quote:
WHO hasn’t yet decided when its response to the contagion will be examined because the pandemic is ongoing, said Christy Feig, a WHO spokeswoman in Geneva. Yesterday, the Parliamentary Assembly of the Council of Europe said “false pandemics, a threat to health” will be a major theme of its next plenary session, with a debate slated for Jan. 28.

Health authorities worldwide are assessing whether their response to swine flu is justified by its threat as cases retreat in the U.S. and Western Europe. The new H1N1 virus, which has targeted children and younger adults, has so far resulted in fewer deaths than attributed to seasonal strains, which kills mostly the frail elderly.

From here:  [url=http://www.businessweek.com/news/2010-01-12/who-to-review-swine-flu-resp... Week[/url]

jas

Thanks, Polly B. This seems to support the earlier report nobody was quite sure about.

ennir

Thanks for those links Tigana and Polly. 

I am so glad I did not get that shot.

RANGER

Unionist wrote:

RP, you can be the last one left standing. I'm going down with the herd.

 

 

 

Well, I hope you survive I'm not sure what kind of things that elixer is going to do to you down the road, maybe a name change to "capitalist" ? it would be better than a third eye ball! ........ or would it? 

Polly B Polly B's picture

It's interesting that we are seeing so many ads now aimed at Canadians who still haven't got their H1N1 shot.  "I am the Chief Public Health Officer and I urge all Canadians to get the flu shot.....we have PLENTY!"  followed by clips of pregnant women and seniors. 

jas

Let's remember that the action described here is an investigation by the WHO of its own use of the term pandemic, and not an investigation of the vaccine itself.

jas

Polly, that's because the shipments came in a little too late for the normally timed flu clinics. They have way too much of the stuff right now and need to get rid of it before it expires. I'm guessing this is the case in other countries, as well.

Polly B Polly B's picture

Sure, that's obvious. 

But I would assume that people who haven't been vaccinated at this point have made that choice for whatever reason, and it would be difficult at this point in time to be ignorant of the supposed potential for flu and the supposed need for vaccination.  So the ads are aimed at people who have chosen not to be vaccinated, and since the "pandemic" appears to be (a) over exaggerated and (b) over, I am wondering why the push?  Perhaps the Govt of Canada just doesn't want to have to explain come budget time why they purchased waaay too much vaccine for a pandemic that never materialized from a company that didn't give refunds.

Polly B Polly B's picture

jas wrote:

Let's remember that the action described here is an investigation by the WHO of its own use of the term pandemic, and not an investigation of the vaccine itself.

 

True.  But the same German scientist involved in this investigation had something to say about that as well.

Quote:

Lung specialist Wolfgang Wodarg has said that there are many risks associated with the vaccine for the H1N1 virus.

He has grave reservations about the firm Novartis who are developing the vaccine and testing it in Germany. The vaccination is injected "with a very hot needle”, Wodarg said.

The nutrient solution for the vaccine consists of cancerous cells from animals and "we do not know if there could be an allergic reaction". But more importantly, some people fear that the risk of cancer could be increased by injecting the cells.

The vaccine - as Johannes Löwer, president of the Paul Ehrlich Institute, has pointed out - can also cause worse side effects than the actual swine flu virus.

 

[url=http://www.wodarg.de/english/2695019.html]Summer 2009[/url]

NDPP

Drug Firms 'Drove swine flu pandemic warning to recoup billions spent on research:

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1246370/Drug-firms-drove-swine-f...

Polly B Polly B's picture

Quote:
As a result, millions of people have been vaccinated against a mild illness, and money that could have been used to prevent and treat major killers such as heart disease has been squandered.

jas

Very interesting.

Quote:

Also giving evidence, Professor Ulrich Keil, a WHO adviser on heart disease, said the decision had led to a 'gigantic misallocation' of health budgets.

'We know the great killers are hypertension, smoking, high cholesterol, high body mass index, physical inactivity and low fruit and vegetable intake,' he said.

'In spite of all these facts, governments instead wasted huge amounts of money by investing in pandemic scenarios whose evidence base is weak.'

Of course, I agree with Sineed that we may still have not seen the end of the outbreaks. Let's just hope someone somewhere doesn't get the idea to start manufacturing the problem in order to justify the already spent dollars.

I wonder if the surplus stock of vaccine we now have will still be good for use come spring? Anyone know? Or does it expire quickly?

jas

Given that we will undoubtedly encounter future outbreaks of concern, what should be the response of governments? Unconditionally invest money based on possible threats? Can we afford this? It seems like health budgets have to scrimp in many areas already; is it OK to override these budgets whenever a new bug comes along?

Tigana Tigana's picture

Yes, as ennir, jas, fidel and some others said... all along. 

remind remind's picture

personally, am wondering how many people who had the shot have been continually sick with one thing or another since they got it, as those I know who did get it have been ad naseum, and IMV much more so than they normally ever have been.

 

RANGER

jas wrote:

Very interesting.

Quote:

Also giving evidence, Professor Ulrich Keil, a WHO adviser on heart disease, said the decision had led to a 'gigantic misallocation' of health budgets.

'We know the great killers are hypertension, smoking, high cholesterol, high body mass index, physical inactivity and low fruit and vegetable intake,' he said.

'In spite of all these facts, governments instead wasted huge amounts of money by investing in pandemic scenarios whose evidence base is weak.'

Of course, I agree with Sineed that we may still have not seen the end of the outbreaks. Let's just hope someone somewhere doesn't get the idea to start manufacturing the problem in order to justify the already spent dollars.

I wonder if the surplus stock of vaccine we now have will still be good for use come spring? Anyone know? Or does it expire quickly?

 

I understand they are expired in  a few short months

Sineed

jas wrote:
I wonder if the surplus stock of vaccine we now have will still be good for use come spring? Anyone know? Or does it expire quickly?

Flu vaccines have an expiry date of the following August (ie August 2010); I'll check our H1N1 shots next time I'm at work, but that's the way they usually are.

jas

That's good, at least.

Fidel

[url=http://www.wodarg.de/presse/pressespiegel/3022454.html]Flu Scare a veritable financing plan for Big Pharma says German social democrat[/url]

Quote:
Ninety-four million doses for five million people who chose to be vaccinated: cherchez the blooper! After having conducted the matter like a Napoleonic battle, the government beats a retreat to the point of negotiating (on what conditions?) the cancellation of half the order for vaccines ... At the hour of reckoning, a wind of panic blows through the Palace. For who will have benefited from this collective hysteria? The laboratories, obviously: spending 870 millions euros on four of them was no longer a precautionary principle, but a veritable financing plan!

The main beneficiaries? GlaxoSmithKline (GSK), Novartis et Sanofi-Aventis: over a billion euros of additional revenues in the fourth quarter for the GSK, between 350 and 500 millions for the two others ... Not only did the organized psychosis fill their coffers, but governments, transformed into super-sales-reps, are taking responsibility for assuring their products' resale! In a global market estimated at 600 billion dollars (it has doubled in ten years), everyone will have understood that for the laboratories the stakes resemble a trade war in which anything is allowed. Who will still dare to say that public control over these private mastodons is not an absolute necessity? The French Parliament would do well to provide itself with a commission of inquiry. And soon.

Tigana Tigana's picture

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Vy2ua57Kllk

Leaked Council on Foreign Relations/CFR audio file

'How to get the public to take the h1n1 vaccine The "H1N1 Vaccine Shortage" Propaganda is A LIE to send 'you' running to the H1N1 Vaccination

Center to line up for your lethal jab!

The H1N1 Herald/Carrier Wave Virus has been upgraded in the population outside Baxter's Vaccine Laboratory in Ukraine!'

More information at LabVirus.com.

G. Muffin

jas wrote:

Given that we will undoubtedly encounter future outbreaks of concern, what should be the response of governments? Unconditionally invest money based on possible threats? Can we afford this? It seems like health budgets have to scrimp in many areas already; is it OK to override these budgets whenever a new bug comes along?

Promote public health & safety in general terms.  And then treat it as it comes.  Same way I conquered bipolar schizoaffective borderline personality disorder with tenuous family relationships and poor overall functioning.  (Thanks, Mark Atkins & VIHA!)

I take libel pretty seriously.  I'm prepared to post the discharge summary should anyone care to see it.  

In fact, I'm posting it later this morning at photobucket.  

EFSA_Pie

Knock yourself out.

RevolutionPlease RevolutionPlease's picture

[url=http://cnews.canoe.ca/CNEWS/Canada/2010/02/06/12778401.html]More paralysis stories after flu shot.
Kingston woman on mend, hoping to walk again[/url]

 

Quote:

So exactly how many have really been devastated by this highly touted vaccine? And why is Quebec the only province that has a no-fault compensation program for the unlucky few who suffer such a crippling side effect?

Sineed

The chance of getting Guillaine Barre syndrome from influenza is 4-7 times higher than getting it from the flu shot.  The numbers so far don't show an increased incidence with the H1N1 shot.

Keep in mind about 600 Canadians per year get GB, usually from infectious diseases like food poisoning, or influenza.

RevolutionPlease RevolutionPlease's picture

Indeed, Sineed.  How come we don't have a compensation system like most other first-world countries?

Tigana Tigana's picture

National Post on flu shots: "Futile"

'Coming at the end of the largest flu-vaccination campaign in Canadian history, the review of previous studies calls for stepped-up research into alternative, lower-tech ways to combat the virus, such as improved hand washing.

"What troubled us is that [shots] had no effect on laboratory-confirmed influenza," said Dr. Roger Thomas of the University of Calgary, lead author of the paper published by the respected Cochrane Library.

"What we were looking for is proof that influenza ... is decreased. Didn't find it. We looked for proof that pneumonia is reduced. Didn't find it. We looked for proof deaths from pneumonia are reduced. Didn't find it."'

Read more: http://www.nationalpost.com/news/story.html?id=2668629#ixzz0hqtjlMFW 

pogge

Tigana wrote:

National Post on flu shots: "Futile"

No. Dr. Tom Jefferson: "Futile." He's well known as a vaccination skeptic. While the article isn't clear I'm guessing this is another study on seasonal vaccines. The article is clear that the study focused specifically on nursing home occupants. Controversy concerning the effectiveness of the seasonal vaccine on the elderly isn't at all new. And a study on the seasonal vaccine doesn't necessarily tell you much about a vaccine that's matched to a specific virus or its effectiveness on the young, who were more likely to become seriously ill or die from H1N1.

ETA: Dueling studies.

[url=http://www.google.com/hostednews/canadianpress/article/ALeqM5iEYGEZLvNos... to reduce amount of flu in adults? Vaccinate kids, study shows[/url]

Quote:
TORONTO - A landmark study looking at how to limit the spread of influenza has shown what experts have long believed but hadn't until now proved: Giving flu shots to kids helps protect everyone in a community from the virus.

The study, led by Dr. Mark Loeb of McMaster University in Hamilton, Ont., showed the risk of catching the flu was lowered by nearly 60 per cent in communities where a substantial portion of kids aged three to 15 got flu shots.

Via [url=http://scienceblogs.com/effectmeasure/2010/03/flu_vaccines_herd_immunity... who comments:

Quote:
Bottom line: flu vaccines work to significantly reduce outbreaks when school aged children are vaccinated in isolated populations. Although we knew that already, now the nay sayers will have to find another objection. And they will be able to do so, as I just demonstrated. Because just doing an RCT isn't a definitive answer. It just produces more questions.

Science is like that.

 

Le T Le T's picture

Want to increase the profits of pharma corps? Vaccinate kids for the flue, study shows.

 

 

pogge

Would the vaccine itself be any more or less effective if we nationalized GlaxoSmithKline?

remind remind's picture

ya, I hear you Le T, and  given the settlement they had to pay out, it is quite apparent they needed to recoup for their shareholders sake...those poor, poor people whose stock portfolio took a hit and thus are looking at "less" in their retirement years.

 

Oh...should not say a thing about that I guess, as it is speaking against "class solidarity" and all of that crap.

 

Then of course there is now Pfizer and the Champix class action suits launched. Are we going to be looking at a recoup by them in a couple of years?

 

And apparentlly not enough people have viewed  nor read  The Constant Gardner

Caissa

You're wasting your breath, pogge. Unfortunately!

Timebandit Timebandit's picture

Teh stupid is the only known substance to burn without actual fuel.

pogge

Caissa wrote:

You're wasting your breath, pogge. Unfortunately!

Not necessarily. The links are there for people who are interested. (And I thought The Constant Gardener was a good read. Can't comment on the film.)

Caissa

You're always the optimist,pogge. Wink

There  are many days I would benefit from taking a page from your book.

ennir

Where did that pandemic go? 

Even with all the propaganda, not enough were vaccinated to demonstrate that vaccinations stopped it and yet it seems to have vanished along with the hundreds of millions that we just paid to be terrorized.  LOL

remind remind's picture

yes ennir, I agree, and I would say to them shilling for h1n1 vaccination,  back at them with post #94.

pogge

Mar. 8, 2010, Thailand: [url=http://www.bangkokpost.com/news/local/170766/h1n1-death-toll-rises-to-21... death toll rises to 218[/url]

Mar. 9, 2010, London: [url=http://www.iol.co.za/index.php?click_id=31&art_id=nw20100308222417639C79... flu seen lying low, then rising again[/url]

Quote:
The European Centre for Disease Prevention and Control (ECDC) said the H1N1 swine flu virus would probably spread at low levels during 2010's spring and summer, and be the dominant and threatening strain in the winter flu season.

Mar. 9, 2010, Rwanda: [url=http://allafrica.com/stories/201003090112.html]Swine Flu Reported in Burera[/url]

Mar. 10, 2010, Malaysia: [url=http://thestar.com.my/news/story.asp?file=/2010/3/10/nation/201003101941...(H1N1): Five ILI clusters in the country[/url]

Mar. 10, 2010, Delaware, U.S.: [url=http://www.syracuse.com/newsflash/index.ssf?/base/national-110/126821777... County man dies from swine flu[/url]

Mar. 10, 2010, India: [url=http://www.newkerala.com/news/fullnews-65925.html]Youth succumbs to H1N1, toll mounts to 297[/url]

 

pogge

Source: CDC

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