The future of Facebook

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Mr. Magoo Mr. Magoo's picture

Quote:
'Five Eyes' Allies Urge Digital Industry To Stop Child Pornographers, Terrorists

...

Manufacturing consent for more censorship and surveillance.

Meh.  I'm OK with child pornographers and terrorists facing the music.

But you?  Are you worried that teleSUR will have their microphone shut off for a few hours again?  I assume you're siding with teleSUR, and not worried about the child pornographers and terrorists, yes?

Or is it that "first they criminalized child pornography, then they criminalized arguing in defense of a living wage!!!!!"

What's the link here between what you're talking about, and what you actually care about?

 

NDPP

'Five Eyes' Summit in Australia Ramps Up Internet Censorship

http://wsws.org/en/articles/2018/09/05/five-s05.html

"Despite the high-profile character of the gathering, the event received almost no publicity. The communique also denounced tech companies for not meeting with Five Eyes officials to discuss clamping down further on social media. The Five Eyes edicts signal an even more draconian offensive."

NDPP

Zuckerberg Admits Social Media is a Weapon, Says Facebook in 'Arms Race' Against 'Bad Actors'

http://rt.com/op-ed/437727-zuckerberg-oped-arms-race/

"If you had any lingering doubt that Facebook has been little more than a vehicle for US government censorship and Western propaganda, a recent Washington Post oped by Mark Zuckerberg should remove any ambiguity. In his short and snappy  op-ed, Mark Zuckerberg admits that 'protecting democracy' is an arms race and reaffirms Facebook's commitment to winning. Put another way, Zuckerberg is telling us that social media is a weapon and that he has picked a side..."

 

In Senate Hearing, Facebook Pledges to Replace 'Bad Speech' with 'Alternative Facts'

http://wsws.org/en/articles/2018/09/06/cens-s06.html

"Wednesday's testimony before the Senate Intelligence Committee by Facebook Chief Operating Officer Sheryl Sandberg and Twitter CEO Jack Dorsey was a milestone in the transformation of the social media companies into an advanced system of censorship and propaganda. If one were to judge by Sandberg's public statements before the Senate, the world's largest social network has dissolved itself into the American state intelligence apparatus and vice versa."

voice of the damned

WSWS wrote:

The claims by right-wing Republicans that they are being censored by the technology giants, and the antics of Jones and his fascistic allies, are sideshows aimed at distracting attention from the fact that left-wing political opposition is the central target of the censorship by Facebook, Twitter and Google, amid the creation of the framework of a police state.

re: "aimed at"

So, Jones doesn't really believe that he's being censored, but he's deliberately pretending to worry about being censored, to distract attention from the censoring of the left? That's really the only interpetation of the writer's words that I can come up with, but it seems pretty goofy.

And let's be honest here. If social media outlets were only censoring Jones and his facistic allies, but leaving the left alone, would WSWS really be all that concerened about the violation of some First Amendment right to he hosted on Facebook?

voice of the damned

By the way, if you get the chance, the video of Jones heckling Marco Rubio, who was actually on Jones' side, is pretty funny. But I think Jones might need to get his ideological epithets in order. At the end, he calls Rubio a "frat boy", and tells him to "go back to the bath house". Aren't anti-frat and homophobic rhetoric the properties of the left and right, respectively? Oh well, red/brown politics and all.

https://tinyurl.com/ya9rxcqn

voice of the damned

That Rubio-Jones exchange reminds me of when Marilyn Manson played in Edmonton in the late 90s. Some of the local fundamentalist Christians showed up to protest his satanic debaucheries, and were met by a contingent of "free-speech" counter-demonstrators. Hilarity ensued when some of the Manson fans somehow got into a fight with the "free speech" group, and ended up getting their asses kicked by the very people who were defending the right of their hero to perform.

Mobo2000

""And let's be honest here. If social media outlets were only censoring Jones and his facistic allies, but leaving the left alone, would WSWS really be all that concerened about the violation of some First Amendment right to he hosted on Facebook?"

I hope they would be, and I think they would be.  

 

Mobo2000

Matt Taibbi on this --

https://www.rollingstone.com/politics/politics-features/facebook-censors...

"This is the nuance people are missing. It’s not that people like Jones shouldn’t be punished; it’s the means of punishment that has changed radically.

For more than half a century, we had an effective, if slow, litigation-based remedy for speech violations. The standards laid out in cases like New York Times v. Sullivan were designed to protect legitimate reporting while directly remunerating people harmed by bad speech. Sooner or later, people like Alex Jones would always crash under crippling settlements. Meanwhile, young reporters learned to steer clear of libel and defamation. Knowing exactly what we could and could not get away with empowered us to do our jobs, confident that the law had our backs.

If the line of defense had not been a judge and jury but a giant transnational corporation working with the state, journalists taking on banks or tech companies or the wrong politicians would have been playing intellectual Russian roulette. In my own career, I’d have thought twice before taking on a company like Goldman Sachs. Any reporter would.

Now the line is gone. Depending on the platform, one can be banned for “glorifying violence,” “sowing division,” “hateful conduct” or even “low quality,” with those terms defined by nameless, unaccountable executives, working with God Knows Whom.

The platforms will win popular support for removals by deleting jackasses like Jones. Meanwhile, the more dangerous censorship will go on in the margins with fringe opposition sites — and in the minds of reporters and editors, who will unconsciously start retreating from wherever their idea of the line is.

The most ominous development involves countries asking for direct cleansing of opposition movements, a la China’s search engine, or Tel Aviv’s demands that Facebook and Google delete pages belonging to Palestinian activists. (This happened: Israel’s justice minister said last year that Facebook granted 95 percent of such requests.)"

Mr. Magoo Mr. Magoo's picture

Quote:
So, Jones doesn't really believe that he's being censored, but he's deliberately pretending to worry about being censored, to distract attention from the censoring of the left? That's really the only interpetation of the writer's words that I can come up with, but it seems pretty goofy.

Here's an alternate interpretation to try on for size.

Both the wooly-headed left and the loony-right both feel that they're being "censored" (I think we've been over that 1000x on babble... short answer, they're not) by some website(s) because their posts have become just a bit too obviously AWESOME and they're CLEARLY TOO CLOSE TO THE TRUTH and that's why they're in jeopardy.

Certainly not because both pointy fringes of the bell curve are stupid and say stupid things that aren't true to support their stupid fringe-y, pointy ideologies.

Look out, anti-vaxxers.  Look out, flat-earthers.  Look out, homeopathic quacks!  Soon enough it'll be your turn to have the bandwidth turned off because you dared to tell people "the truth!!!"

voice of the damned

Mr. Magoo wrote:

Look out, flat-earthers.... Soon enough it'll be your turn to have the bandwidth turned off because you dared to tell people "the truth!!!"

Click on the video to see some top-notch revolt against the gatekeepers.

https://tinyurl.com/yc3aoubh

At about 1:20, I love the way he says "...YOU guys..." with that sinister undertone.

NDPP

Big Brother is Keeping 'Five Eyes' on You

http://rt.com/op-ed/437895-primacy-five-eyes-encryption

"Given that Facebook has been breaching our privacy in favor of government agencies for a long time now, you can rest assured that Zuckerberg will not put up any meaningful resistance to this new decree issued by the Five Eyes network..."

NDPP

Watching the Hawks -  Policing Free Speech

https://youtu.be/H7JdA6R4WJU

@ 15:00 Investigative Rolling Stone mag's Matt Taibbi on Facebook, the Atlantic Council and the corporate policing of free speech. 'An extraordinary, terrifying development.'

NDPP

Threats to Freedom: Facebook's Atlantic Council Censors...

https://on.rt.com/9e97

"Like all foreign policy and military think-tanks the Atlantic Council exists to manufacture consent for the goals of its paymasters. It hit the jackpot when the world's largest social network put it in charge of censorship..."

Mr. Magoo Mr. Magoo's picture

It's a big internet, and there are always other options.

If you think that Facebook is censoring your lies, consider Diaspora.  Get your message out to the hundreds and hundreds of Diaspora users.

Rabble/babble has NEVER felt obligated to host all opinions and ideas.  Why should any other private host like rabble/babble?  Why is it on them to provide a microphone to any idjit that wants one?

NDPP

Facebook Censors Think Progress

https://www.wsws.org/en/articles/2018/09/14/thnk-s14.html

"On Monday, a ThinkProgress article posted in Facebook was labeled as 'fake' by right-wing magazine The Weekly Standard, a third-party 'fact-checker' for Facebook, and effectively censored on the site. As a result of the Weekly Standard's 'fact checking', the ThinkProgress story, entitled 'Brett Kavanaugh said he would kill Roe v Wade last week and almost no one noticed' will be accompanied by a companion article from the Weekly Standard..."

Mr. Magoo Mr. Magoo's picture

LOL.  Even the ever-woolyheaded WSWS seems to acknowledge that Kavanaugh said no such thing, ever.

Quote:
As a result of the Weekly Standard’s “fact-checking,” the ThinkProgress story, entitled “Brett Kavanaugh said he would kill Roe v. Wade last week and almost no one noticed” will be accompanied by a companion article from the Weekly Standard: “Fact Check: Has Brett Kavanaugh ‘Stated He’d Overturn’ Roe v. Wade?”

I've noticed, though, that when the k00Ks lack something sufficiently controversial to inflame the rebellious passions of the people then they'll just make something up based solely on assumptions.  "Local politician wants to see citizens die grisly deaths" rather than just "Local politican abstains from vote on new Stop sign".  I really don't think the internet will be any the lesser for getting rid of that silliness.

And the k00Ks are still allowed to tell the truth, as boring as it might be sometimes.

voice of the damned

I'm not crazy, to put it mildly, about the Weekly Standard being one of Facebook's go-to orgs for "fake news" discernment. Those guys are worse than Trump, IMO, and I think that FB users are being well-served if someone tells them about this.

But "FB users" is a category that does not include me, and at the end of the day, what gets banned from that site is between the site and its users. I know there is some movement afoot(I've got a book at home arguing the case) to extend constitutional free-speech provisions to social-media, because so many people conduct their lives via Facebook, it practically IS the internet, for them.

But I remain unconvinced. To me, it's like saying, back in the days when the daily newspaper was king, that since almost all newspaper readers in Edmonton, for example, choose the Journal(true between 1951 and 1978), the Journal is thus obligated to host a variety of opinions, because otherwise their readers will be denied access to the full range of political views.

Mobo2000

Facebook takes down some pages about BC municipal electoral candidates:

https://www.theglobeandmail.com/canada/british-columbia/article-bc-candidates-targeted-by-anonymous-social-media-posts/

"

Facebook has shut down two accounts linked to Vancouver’s civic election, declaring the accounts violate its policies and that the company has placed a priority on preventing election interference.

Facebook took down one account that was promoting mayoral candidate Hector Bremner, under the name Vancouverites for Affordable Housing. Another account disparaging the Non-Partisan Association’s (NPA) candidate with the page name Vancouver Deserves Better Than Ken Sim was also taken down.

“This is honestly just the nastiest election cycle ever,” said Mike Witherly, who is a campaign strategist with the NPA. The party complained about both of the Facebook pages that were ultimately taken down.

“I think people are getting ideas as they see the investigation into Russian interference [in the American elections]. It’s giving people a sense of its effectiveness and prompting people to try it.”

NDPP

'Land of Censorship & Home of the Fake': Alternative Voices on Facebook and Twitter's Crackdown (and vid)

https://on.rt.com/9gd9

"Alternative voices online are incensed after Facebook and Twitter closed down hundreds of political media pages ahead of November's crucial midterm elections. 'No more Free Thought for you!' quipped journalist Max Blumethal, while anti-war journalist Caitlin Johnstone described the shutdown as 'the latest escalation of corporate censorship used as state censorship in the west..."

voice of the damned

 'the latest escalation of corporate censorship used as state censorship in the west..."

If you wanna say "used in lieu of state censorship" or maybe "used to go after the same targets that the state dislikes" that's okay, but the phrasing as written is a ham-fisted attempt at conflation.

Something is either state censorship or it's not. That's because the state has the actual power to physically prevent you from writing or publishing something, whereas the worst that Facebook can do is kick you off their website.  

Mr. Magoo Mr. Magoo's picture

"political media pages".

NDPP

Alternative Media is Under Attack From All Angles (and vid)

https://www.rt.com/shows/watching-the-hawks/441152-facebook-bans-blevins...

"Facebook has unleashed a concerning new and brazen round of account purges. Journalist Max Blumenthal and RT America correspondent Rachel Blevins join the show to discuss."

 

Facebook Crackdown on Alternative Media (and vid)

https://www.rt.com/shows/in-question/441134-facebook-crackdown-on-altern...

"Anya Parampil breaks down a new effort by Facebook to stop what it calls political spam from circulating on its site. Facebook used the opportunity to remove very popular pages..."

NDPP

Internet Censorship Just Took An Unprecedented Leap Forward And Hardly Anyone Noticed

https://t.co/7gg9ltEY3u

"...It is now clear that there is (A) some degree of communication/coordination between Twitter and Facebook about their respective censorship practices, or (B) information given to both Twitter and Facebook by another party regarding targets for censorship. Either way, it means that there is now some mechanism in place linking the censorship of dissident voices across multiple platforms. We are beginning to see smaller anti-establishment alternative media outlets cut off from their audiences by the same sort of coordinated cross-platform silencing we first witnessed with Alex Jones in August. 

This is huge, this is dangerous and this is under-reported..."

Mr. Magoo Mr. Magoo's picture

"dissident voices".

NDPP

The US Military's Vision For State Censorship

https://www.wsws.org/en/articles/2018/10/05/pers-o05.html

"...The Atlantic Council report, based on high-level discussions with the military and state, is a confirmation of everything the WSWS has said about the purpose of changes in the algorithms and internet and social media companies over the past year-and-a-half. But the Atlantic Council document presents the most clear, direct and unvarnished explanation of the regime of state censorship. The struggle against censorship is the spearhead of the defense of all democratic rights."

Sean in Ottawa

The thing is Facebook is not stand alone. They have marketed their login as the gateway to so many other sites that avoiding Facebook means not having access to many other sites. This is how they make a Facebook demise more difficult to see in the short term.

Caissa

This is not meant as an insult, Babble will be gone long before Facebook.

voice of the damned

Caissa wrote:

This is not meant as an insult, Babble will be gone long before Facebook.

I wouldn't be so sure. If you had told me thirty years ago that the local, family-owned sports equipment shop down the road from my house would outlive Sears, I probably would have said you were nuts. But it's still there, and Sears, well...

That said, if we were making predictions about which outfit would have the more glorious history, financially speaking, that honour would have to go to Sears, even factoring in current tragedies. The family-owned sports shop in my old neighbourhood is still confined to one store, I believe.

Mr. Magoo Mr. Magoo's picture

Quote:
Babble will be gone long before Facebook.

Well, I suppose someone, someday might shut it down with force of law.

But I don't really imagine some new social media site drawing all of FB's users away, nor FB being unable to pay the bills. 

Heck, if FB said "sorry, folks, but we spent all the money on pennywhistles and moon pies, so we have no choice but to shut down now" you'd see a GoFundMe campaign like we've never seen before.

NDPP

TRNN: Facebook Erases Hundreds of Alternative Media Pages in Mass Purge (1/2)

https://youtu.be/UiBKj1RTS30

"Facebook is erasing popular alternative media pages that had millions of likes and suspending anti-war and anti police brutality accounts acting in coordination with Twitter..."

Mr. Magoo Mr. Magoo's picture

Quote:
Facebook is erasing popular alternative media pages that had millions of likes and suspending anti-war and anti police brutality accounts

So they're removing them SPECIFICALLY for being anti-war or anti-brutality?  Or is there more?

Because this entire thread is dancing around the other "F" word -- Fake news.  If a site is spreading bullshit under a pretend account, I don't really feel like they're our allies just because they also don't like war.

What's the whole truth?

NDPP

Updated: In Latest Fit of Censorship, Facebook Deletes Video Detailing Brutal Legacy of Christopher Columbus

https://www.commondreams.org/news/2018/10/17/updated-latest-fit-censorsh...

"Monbiot's piece of journalism was about the airbrushing of history. Therefore, there is a great irony in the fact it has now been airbrushed from Facebook's platform."

NATO's proxy censor, the Atlantic Council, hard at work protecting you .  

MegB

Babble predates FB by several years and has survived and thrived beyond the FB phenomenum, despite many concluding that FB would see its demise. So long as rabble.ca exists, babble will continue as a forum for progressive and alternative thought and discussion. 

Sean in Ottawa

Facebook has some very dedicated followers but it is largely generic social media. Volume is not staying power (Anyone up for Pokemon Go?)

Babble is a smaller group of course but it is committed and not generic with fewer potential replacements. I would not bet on Facebook outliving babble.

WWWTT

Caissa wrote:

This is not meant as an insult, Babble will be gone long before Facebook.

Not in communist China!

I came back from a 6 week visit in China, there I regularly visited rabble/babble. Read Rabble news articles/blogs and read the babble forums. But I promised myself to not sign in and start commenting because i was on vacation and couldn’t afford the time. 

FB is banned for the most part of mainland China  

Oh the irony MegB!

NDPP

Very interesting. Apparently facts do not accord with msm disseminated theory. Who duh thunk it?

NDPP

Facebook Censorship of Alternative Media 'Just the Beginning', Says Top Neocon Insider

https://t.co/1gJ3svhBAo

"At a Berlin security conference, hardline neocon Jamie Fly appeared to claim credit for Facebook's recent purge of alternative media outlets and promised 'This is just the beginning."

NDPP

Facebook Hired PR Firm To Label Its Critics 'Agents of Soros'

https://on.rt.com/9io7

"In a bid to counteract negative publicity, social media giant Facebook hired a PR agency to discredit critics claiming that they were agents of liberal billionaire George Soros, a NYT report has revealed..."

Michael Moriarity Michael Moriarity's picture

NDPP wrote:

Facebook Hired PR Firm To Label Its Critics 'Agents of Soros'

https://on.rt.com/9io7

"In a bid to counteract negative publicity, social media giant Facebook hired a PR agency to discredit critics claiming that they were agents of liberal billionaire George Soros, a NYT report has revealed..."

So, has the untrustworthy, imperialist New York Times story been validated by being quoted on rt? LOL.

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