Legal Cannabis in Canada

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Pondering

Who knew?

https://www.ctvnews.ca/canada/ontario-cannabis-store-mislabels-genital-s...

But also on offer is a cannabis-infused "intimate" spray, marketed under the enticingly named Fleur de Lune, which contains eight milligrams of the psychoactive ingredient THC, as well as the cannabinoid CBD.

.......

The only problem is that the Ontario Cannabis Store had initially mislabelled how to apply the product, saying it was for "sublingual" use, which means under the tongue -- in other words, orally.

Okay that makes more sense

Asked Wednesday by reporters at the Ontario Legislature if the intimate spray is an appropriate product for the province to be selling, Finance Minister Vic Fedeli would only say: "We'll leave it to the … Ontario Cannabis Store to continue to put products out there that the people of Ontario are looking forward to purchasing."

The 30-millilitre bottle of Fleur de Lune Intimate Spray, which has been approved by Health Canada, sells online for $82.95 and yields about 300 shots of mist.

Cannabis is over 18, labeling is discreet, it's mail order in Ontario. Sex between consenting adults is legal. Even Christians do it. I don't see the problem. 

"The thing about cannabis is that one of the largest areas of concentrations of cannabinoid receptors in the body is in fact the skin," Lake said Wednesday from Gatineau, Que.

I didn't know that!

Mr. Magoo Mr. Magoo's picture

$83 for weed to spray on your junk. 

Every day we stray further from God.

Pondering

I am so surprised that Rick Mercer is so out of touch! Shocked even. He thought Trudeau made a mistake and meant decriminalization not legalization and when he found out otherwise he thought he would lose the election over it. 

https://montrealgazette.com/news/local-news/watch-rick-mercer-says-the-s...

It really is like a segment of the population is completely out of touch. This was 1972.

The recommendations of Gerald Le Dain, Heinz Lehmann and J. Peter Stein included the repeal of the prohibition against the simple possession of cannabis and cultivation for personal use.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Le_Dain_Commission_of_Inquiry_into_the_Non...

A large majority of people don't consume cannabis in any form and don't intend to, but even my 87 year old mother knew it isn't a big deal and is less impairing than alcohol. It's a cliche that fights happen at alcohol parties not pot parties. Pierre Burton and Trudeau admit to smoking it. It's been legalized in many states. Medical has been legal for years. 

I'm not saying it's nothing but have people been living under a rock? Or maybe not.  Perhaps we are so discreet we are mostly unnoticable. 

 

kropotkin1951 kropotkin1951's picture

Pondering wrote:

I ordered from 28grams and was satisfied with the price. 100$. I'll check out the shop. How was the selection Alan?

So the prices seem to say it is cheaper to order on line rather than at the government store, that should be fun to watch. I went into the site and while there where a few "loss leader" deals some of the pot was very expensive. Personally I don't see myself changing my preference for buying local from trusted sources.  The going rate these days for quality organic hydroponic grown ounces is $140 or $5 a gram but I since it is harvest time and I like good outdoor pot and have been buying from the same suppliers for years I get it for about $2.75 a gram, by the pound.

I think in BC this will result in a unique island bootlegging culture. BC's illegal Mom and Pop pot industry is not likely to go away. It is hard to say what slice of the pie the small unlicensed growers will keep of an industry in BC that is estimated to be worth between 2 and 5 Billion dollars.

https://cannabislifenetwork.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/08/The-Cannabis-...

https://weedlist.ca/

Pondering

Unfortunately I don't have that great a connection in Montreal but I expect the market to improve under competition. 

I do hope new strains are developed with more sophisticated names. Names like Trainwreck feeds into stoner stereotyping. Even Cinderella99 is childish. Charlotte's Web is okay because it is intended for children who have seizures. We need names that indicate growing conditions and location, like indoor/outdoor, hydro or soil. 

Different strains are called by the same name. There needs to be some sort of testing beyond THC and cannabinoid content and maybe even some standards set on what can be called a haze or a kush or better still just develop completely new categorizations based on landrace and various definable characteristics like beers and wines. 

I'm going to try the government stuff soon just to check it out but it is too expensive. 

 

Mr. Magoo Mr. Magoo's picture

Quote:
or better still just develop completely new categorizations based on landrace and various definable characteristics like beers and wines

Several years ago, the VQA here in Ontario held a contest to come up with a name for a "premium" wine -- they clearly wanted something that suggested prestige and quality, but probably also with a hint of snobbery to it.  And of course it had to be fairly vague (and didn't really even have to "mean" anything at all).

The winner:  "Meritage".

The funnier also-ran:  "Quelque Chose Grandiose".

I remember when weed only had one of two names:  sensi or hydro.

quizzical

i've never heard of sensi or hydro. must be a Ontario label.

some marijuana names are reflective of who created the strain like GOD or  by hair colours. 

nothing much changed in BC yesterday other than in Kamloops and a whole bunch of illegal dispensaries closed awaiting licensing.

just a real pain for unconnected dispensary buyers.

 

NDPP

Tyendinaga Sets Up First Nations Cannabis Control Board

https://twitter.com/JorgeBarrera/status/1053040964577779712

"Tyendinaga sets up FN Cannabis Control Board, says provincial licenses not valid on territory."

Paladin1

MegB wrote:

I've been a pot consumer for more than forty years, though not regularly until a few years ago. It's fantastic for chronic pain and some strains are particularly good for sleep issues and anxiety (far healthier and more effective than pharmaceuticals). For those who just like to get high, it's habit forming but not addictive in the sense that alcohol and opioids are addictive.  People don't smoke pot and then go on murderous rampages. People get drunk and do, yet alcohol consumption has been completely acceptable, for the most part, for millennia. Criminalizing marijuana was a stupid and expensive idea and its end is long overdue.

I drink but not a pot user and yet I've said the same about alcohol. It's caused an incredible about of suffering. Actually watching someone destroy their life right now and powerless to help, so completely agree with you.

I can happily say I'm glad all of you Canadians who harmlessly use pot can do so without fear of police or legal reprecussions. So many people use this stuff for pain, sleep problems, anxiety, trauma.

The smell can be a contentious issue but I'm hoping manners or respect for others can nip that in the bud :)

Seems like a long over due thing.

lagatta4

There are many ways to consume cannabis other than smoking it. Unfortunately not "legal" yet, except for therapeutic uses.

Mr. Magoo Mr. Magoo's picture

It's true that you can't yet legally purchase gummies and lollypops and suchlike (although a lot of dispensaries in TO carry them anyway).

But you can certainly make your own "special" cookies.

A tale:  years ago, when I was in school, I had a friend who I'll call Ted.  Ted was a fairly stereotypical hippie type guy, who kind of seemed stoned even when he wasn't, and he certainly loved weed.  One day he called me up and asked if he could come over to bring me and my wife one of his "special" cookies.  "Sure", I said, and about an hour later he arrived with two big chocolate chip cookies wrapped in tinfoil -- one for each of us.  My wife and I tucked in, grinning.  Then I asked him how much "stuff" he put in each, and he looked at me kind of funny, and told me they were just cookies.  He was proud of the recipe -- and to be fair, they were amazing -- so he brought us each one.  The only secret ingredient was wheat germ.  #bigmisunderstanding

Pondering

https://globalnews.ca/news/4562526/ontario-indigenous-cannabis/

“Any store located within a First Nations reserve would require approval by the communities’ Chief and Council by way of a band council resolution before the AGCO issues a retail store authorization,” Mulroney’s office said in a statement.

Good luck trying to enforce that. 

Toronto cannabis lawyer Jack Lloyd has concerns. “It’s a complete grey area and it’s uncertain how it’s going to be regulated in their territories. It’s part of a broader argument about self-government and self-determination for those communities.”

Lloyd says a legal battle is brewing and that he’s hearing from Indigenous communities that are ready for the fight.

“I would argue they have an economic right to interact with the cannabis plant. I think that is a profound argument. It is certainly very connected with arguments about self-governance, and I think that Ottawa and Ontario need to be cognizant of that and recognize what’s happening there and see it as a good thing.”

The thing is cannabis is easier to grow than tomatoes. That is why it has been impossible to shut it down. If indigenous peoples want an entirely self-contained industry from production to sale they can do it easily.

What are we going to do? Invade with police? Good luck with that. Their territory is huge and this would be a stupid issue to risk physical conflict or blockades over. The days are over of running roughshot over indigenous rights. They just aren't taking it anywhere they have the power to resist. 

https://www.cbc.ca/news/indigenous/gitanyow-medicinal-cannabis-oil-1.485...

Hereditary chief Wil Marsden has made a name for himself in his community as the guy you see if you need access to cannabis oil.

He's been providing it, free of charge, to people in Gitanyow, B.C., for the past six years — stocking fridges with a supply of syringes filled with the dark, molasses-like oil, instructing people on how to medicate themselves for a whole range of illnesses.

It's deeply personal work for the young​ leader whose father died from prostate cancer in 2011. The day he died in a North Vancouver hospital bed also happened to be day he received his first dose of a synthetic cannabis medication. Marsden said his father had been asking the doctors for access to medicinal marijuana for years.

"He was totally shot down… They probably assumed that he just wanted free weed, I guess," said Marsden.  

"I just want to make sure that nobody goes through what I did, having my father totally denied. And as a hereditary chief I have a responsibility to lead our people."

...

Marsden is most interested in producing whole plant oil locally and educating people about the medicinal properties of the plant through his venture Kitwancool.com. But he's not opposed to selling it for recreational purposes — to him, there's not much of a difference.

Good luck trying to stop him. Trudeau should have declared that indigenous territories could set their own regulations as the provinces do. That way he could at least pretend he had the authority and physical capacity to impose a framework and chose not to. He'd be the hero. He missed the boat on this one. He should have been negotiating controls for cannabis leaving reserves. That's a nation to nation relationship. 

Bacchus

Set up road blocks for customs/police outside any reserve doing it. Then their only customers would be on the reserve

Pondering

Bacchus wrote:
Set up road blocks for customs/police outside any reserve doing it. Then their only customers would be on the reserve

It's impractical to try to set up a border with checks and would imply separate countries which the government will not do. People could just walk through a field. There are no border checks between provinces yet they aren't allowing interprovincial trade. Provinces don't seem to have been successful in preventing people from buying cigarettes on reserves. Government authorities like to give the impression they have a lot of power to force their will but they really don't. Laws work when most people agree to follow them. If everyone started blowing stop signs all the time the police couldn't keep up with ticketing. The consent of the governed really is required in the larger sense. 

The feds simply do not have the power to enforce laws on reserves without the cooperation of on reserve authorities or the people of the community. It isn't worth it to have a mass physical confrontation on reserve over cannabis just as it isn't over tobacco. The tobacco trade could be stopped it just isn't worth the investment in force and the fallout for using it. Same goes for cannabis. Cannabis is even harder to control than tobacco. Tobacco requires significantly more processing than cannabis. Cannabis is easier to product than craft beers. Craft cannabis will be unstoppable over time. I don't know how much time, but within years not decades. I foresee a problem separating the wheat from the chaff.

I'm very relaxed about prohibition 2.0 because it won't work any better than prohibition 1.0. It is widely acknowledged that Canada is leading the way and most other countries will soon legalize. Corporate types are having fits in the US that Canada is getting the jump on them. We are already exporting to other countries. 

Speaking of quality, I haven't found a review site yet for legal cannabis. I'm surprised no one has started something up. 

kropotkin1951 kropotkin1951's picture

My everyday pot has been Seawarp for a number years. Prior to that I smoked a lot of Timewarp. I trust my Texada growers because they developed the strains in the '70's and '80's. There are lots of websites that give you some idea of the various strains available.

Seawarp Outdoor

This strain is a three-way hybrid that is a result of crossing the Sea Level, Texada Timewarp and Ben Johnson strains with one another. The strain offers a very distinctive flavor profile that offers pungent piney and mint undertones while providing a very happy, focused, and relaxed effect. This is a good strain for treating pain, depression, stress, headaches and anxiety.

https://truemeds.ca/_shop/c.php?v=product&id=80

Pondering

Thanks I'll check it out. When I went to the site they said to go to cheebas.ca.  

I don't entirely trust the review sites because they sometimes say opposite things about the same strain. I am interested in old strains and particularly landrace strains. 

I particularly wanted reviews of the legal stuff because it should be more consistent but I find I am not too interested in Quebec's legal offerings. Surfing last night I found this site which has some really good legalization specials. They also do a variety pack but it's pricey to me. 

https://www.budexpressnow.ca/

 

Mr. Magoo Mr. Magoo's picture

Ontario Cannabis Store lit up with complaints about slow delivery, wrong shipments

Here in Ontario, people who ordered legal weed within a few hours of the OCS website going live are still waiting for delivery over a week later (after having been promised three day delivery by the government).

I know new systems will have their hiccups, but eight days and counting??

The government massively dropped the ball on this.  They had ONE chance to show Ontarians that they can handle something as simple as mailing some dried plant to people without fucking up, and they failed to.  Apparently it's not even a supply issue -- there's still stuff for sale, but now people know they might get it a few days from now, or they might not, and nobody's going to inform them or compensate them or do anything other than say "well, we're trying as hard as we can" (and that's if you can even get through to customer service -- some people are saying the wait can be as much as two hours on hold).

If I ever seem generally pessimistic about government ownership, this is precisely why. 

 

voice of the damned

Mr. Magoo wrote:

Ontario Cannabis Store lit up with complaints about slow delivery, wrong shipments

Here in Ontario, people who ordered legal weed within a few hours of the OCS website going live are still waiting for delivery over a week later (after having been promised three day delivery by the government).

I know new systems will have their hiccups, but eight days and counting??

The government massively dropped the ball on this.  They had ONE chance to show Ontarians that they can handle something as simple as mailing some dried plant to people without fucking up, and they failed to.  Apparently it's not even a supply issue -- there's still stuff for sale, but now people know they might get it a few days from now, or they might not, and nobody's going to inform them or compensate them or do anything other than say "well, we're trying as hard as we can" (and that's if you can even get through to customer service -- some people are saying the wait can be as much as two hours on hold).

If I ever seem generally pessimistic about government ownership, this is precisely why. 

Well, I seem to recall reading that there were some pretty major supply issues(as in, very little was available) in Washington State for a few months after they legalized, and I don't THINK they have government-owned stores.

So I'm not sure if public-ownership is neccessarily the culprit here, though admittedly I don't have a solid alternative theory. I do harbour a sort of hazy preconception that, when something has been illegal since forever, legalizing it is not going to be just a walk in the park. But again, that's just kind of a vague hunch.

Overall, I'd say that, if Ontario has brick-and-mortar stores, you'd be crazy to buy on-line, since it's likely going to be a crap game, seeing if the system is going to work or not. Though I guess someone has to be the first to buy on-line, if the system is ever going to get up and running.  

Mr. Magoo Mr. Magoo's picture

Like I say, this doesn't seem to be about supply -- there's still plenty of weed online for sale.

And as far as legalizing it being a challenge, I wouldn't disagree, but that part is already done.

This is just about taking money and shipping orders.  And, evidently, about effectively communicating with customers.  I think people expected a few problems with the new system, but did not expect to be kept in the dark about them.

alan smithee alan smithee's picture

The quality has much to desire,you cant smell it before you buy it..there is a need for many more outlets.Make it like a Tim Horton's  that you can find one on every corner. The prices need to be lower.

I'm happy it's legal but I think they TOTALLY underestimated the popularity this stuff has.

Fix these problems and it will go along much better.

Pondering

I agree that they underestimated but it is taking producers some time to ramp-up production. We do expect it to be fresh. I'm more conerned about the quality. I'm not hearing anything good which is no surprise. They should have tried to absorb the illicit market. Locking out experienced growers was a mistake. 

Everyone obsesses so much over THC yet different strains have varying effects and it isn't just sativa/indica. The draconian rules will fail. It's just too easy to grow. Best thing about legalization so far is prices are going down. The next best thing will be craft growers getting established. 

Pondering

Mr. Magoo wrote:

Like I say, this doesn't seem to be about supply -- there's still plenty of weed online for sale.

And as far as legalizing it being a challenge, I wouldn't disagree, but that part is already done.

This is just about taking money and shipping orders.  And, evidently, about effectively communicating with customers.  I think people expected a few problems with the new system, but did not expect to be kept in the dark about them.

The "plenty of weed online" can't be sold by government approved shops because there is no quality control. It could be full of pesticides. 

Poulos said he expects supply issues outside of B.C. to subside over the next three to six months, so that constraints on supply will no longer factor into price.

“There’s a lot of people in the industry who think that the wholesale price is heading lower, and that’s in order to wipe out the black market over the next several years,” he said.

“Right now the (licensed producers) can demand a higher price, but when there’s lots more out there … the conventional wisdom is we’re heading down to $2 per gram at wholesale. That’ll pull a lot of people in.”

https://vancouversun.com/cannabis/cannabis-business/cannabis-experts/exp...

Pondering

https://www.cbc.ca/news/opinion/politician-cannabis-1.4871840

But there's an obvious reason why Canadians would assume opportunity, rather than a true change of heart, was at play in the cases of Mulroney, Fantino, Oliver, Herb DhaliwalLeona AglukkaqKash HeedErnie Eves and other former politicians who belatedly came to realize the relative innocuousness of medical or recreational marijuana.

 

These aren't average Joes whose views on cannabis have changed; they were and are enormously powerful people who oversaw the arrest, prosecution and punishment of thousands of Canadians who possessed substances about which they have not only changed their views, but which will now be a money-maker for them.

 

To be perceived as truly genuine, such a dramatic, public about-face should probably come with a good degree of humility. Graciousness. Charity toward those you may have wronged, and also toward those with whom you were previously aligned. And the pursuit of lucrative business deals should probably wait, at the very least, until those affected by your past decisions know if and when they may apply for a pardon.

This is infuriating. 

Mr. Magoo Mr. Magoo's picture

Quote:
The "plenty of weed online" can't be sold by government approved shops because there is no quality control. It could be full of pesticides.

I'm referring to plenty of weed online at OCS.ca, the government online cannabis store.  Sadly, we don't have (legal) shops in Ontario yet.

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