NDP premier quits to become Harper's envoy to Washington

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Unionist
NDP premier quits to become Harper's envoy to Washington

This predictable, but still shocking, story deserves its own thread IMO.

By this action, Gary Doer caps his 23-year career as cabinet minister, leader, and premier by following in the footsteps of his predecessor Ed Schreyer, who was named Governor-General immediately upon resigning as NDP leader, and then High Commissioner to Australia upon completing his G-G term.

Schreyer, of course, was crowned by the Trudeau Liberals, while Doer has gone one better.

In announcing his resignation, Doer, finding it hard to conceal his glee, made the following offensive comment about seniors:

Quote:
"What am I going to next? Well, I'm not going to be watching soaps," he almost giddily told his press conference.

There are many examples of leaders of the NDP - and indeed of trade unions (remember Dennis McDermott being named Ambassador to Ireland by Brian Mulroney?) - being "rewarded" for their services by their purported adversaries. Babblers' views on this particular case, and on the general phenomenon, would be most welcome.

 

Caissa

It's interesting. I was reading Filthy Lucre last night in the section where they talk about incentives. Everyone has their "price."

remind remind's picture

Pfft, a typical privileged white male action,  as there is no greater thing other than what they want to do at any given moment.

Sarann

Let's not forget that Stephen Harper is a shallow, empty caricature of a man.  His word is worth less than nothing. He has become a joke.  He thinks if he has his picture taken with soldiers it makes him look strong and capable.  Doesn't care how many millions it costs Canadians for him to be up in the Arctic strutting around. Now he has had his picture taken with a decent man so maybe we will think he is decent.   I actually think this is his real motivation for naming Gary Doer ambassador.  Not what Gary Doer can do for Canada, but what Gary Doer can do for Stephen Harper.

jas

Unionist wrote:
made the following offensive comment about seniors:

Quote:
"What am I going to next? Well, I'm not going to be watching soaps," he almost giddily told his press conference.

Seniors watch soaps?? Why? Because they never better to do during the day, Unionist? That's your assumption, not Doer's.

Anyway, Doer has been very effective at trade missions and making friends in the U.S. It's a surprising announcement but the appointment itself makes sense.

However, if the suggestion is that Harper is enticing strong progressive leaders away from where they have the most benefit, then I am concerned.

 

Slumberjack

The purveyors of capitalist charades peddle different flavours of political Kool-Aid. Some go to great lengths to disguise the fact that they are indeed capitalist enablers, and by and large, in witnessing how the respective adherents swallow what is being sold by the jug, we can clearly see the impressive results achieved through the respective advertising campaigns. When all is said and done, there remains little to differentiate the brands, or the pitchmen.

Stockholm

Its a good appointment. Canada need an ambassador to the US with progressive credentials now that Obama is in power and Doer is as good a person as any. Mulroney made Stephen Lewis ambassador to the UN - and he lived to tell the tale. In any case, in a few short months Doer will be representing a Liberal/NDP coalition government in Washington.

As Chantal Hebert points out in today's Star (and i have to say that whe n she's good she's good). Har cannot stay in power unless he wins a majoriry (which he can't)

http://www.thestar.com/canada/columnist/article/687721

and I don't think that this is about "is enticing strong progressive leaders away from where they have the most benefit" since Doer is not a federal politician and poses no threat to Harper in the first place. I think he wanted to quit as Premier one way or another and if he didn't take this appointment he would have been appointed to something else. That's what ex-premiers do.

Unionist

jas wrote:

Seniors watch soaps?? Why? Because they never better to do during the day, Unionist? That's your assumption, not Doer's.

That's rather incredible how you turned that around, jas. Doer's remark was incredibly offensive, I called him on it, and you think I'm the one accusing seniors of watching soaps!?

You spend a lot of time ridiculing my posts, which is your prerogative, but at least try harder to understand them first.

 

jas

You're the one who equated seniors with soaps, Unionist. Doer never said anything about seniors watching soaps. He said he wasn't going to watch soaps. Lots of people watch soaps. Lots of people who retire are also not "seniors". The equation is in your own head. 

Unionist

Stockholm wrote:

Its a good appointment. Canada need an ambassador to the US with progressive credentials now that Obama is in power and Doer is as good a person as any.

LaughingLaughingLaughing

My you're adaptable. Here's what you said [url=YESTERDAY[/url]:">http://rabble.ca/comment/1053796/if-views][=red]YESTERDAY...

the other Stockholm wrote:
...as if the views on Israel/Palestine of the premier of one of Canada's prairie provinces are of any relevance to anyone?? Are you planning on grilling anyone running for city council in Brandon over their views on a settlement freeze on the West bank??

Turns out Mr. Doer's views on foreign affairs (the Middle East, Afghanistan, U.S. policy) were of [b]great relevance to someone - Stephen Harper! My, how 24 hours can change everything.

LaughingLaughingLaughing

M. Spector M. Spector's picture

Interesting to see how the political elite of the NDP slide so effortlessly into serving the political elites of the capitalist class.

And party members aren't even embarrassed!

duncan cameron

On the earlier thread Stockholm pointed out that Doer will be Canada's envoy to Washington, not Harpers. True, but not in Harpers mind. In Republican think, Ambassadors serve the PM/President himself.  Harper ditched McKenna for Wilson. Actually it did not work out to well.

Wilson made a big mistake by disssing Obama on NAFTA, and making Canada an issue during the election primary, and Layton managed to get Harpers attention in the House on that blunder. The Harper government then did a full grovel.

 

Bookish Agrarian

jas did understand, you are the one looking for anything bad you can say.  Your meme is just plain stupid.

Doer has been the leader of a political party for what 2 decades now.  Resigning to go to another job is not all that unusual.  Pretty typical actually.  Most people try to look for a step up.  If you have been the Premier of a province your step up is not moving from Burger King to MacDonalds.

There is simply nothing wrong with this move, unless of course you are trying to also make the case that Stephen Lewis is a sell out and has demeaned all progressive kind by accepting the appointment he did too.  I on the other hand think most Canadians, including the overwhelming number of progressives believe Stephen Lewis to be one of the best examples of the kinds of values we like to think we have, even if we don't always live up to them.

It must be nice to live in this fantasy world where you can invent all kinds of loyalty tests based on your pet theories of the moment.  It is too bad that Gary Doer was re-elected three times by the people of Manitoba.  If only the Conservatives or Liberals had been in power then we could have had heaven on earth right smack dab in the middle of Canada. 

Pogo Pogo's picture

already stated

derrick derrick's picture

Statement by New Democrat leader Jack Layton the appointment of Premier Gary Doer of
Manitoba to position as U.S. Ambassador:

Premier Gary Doer is a statesman, respected by people across the political spectrum.
He is principled, pragmatic, open-minded and has been an effective and highly
regarded spokesman and advocate for NDP policies.

His appointment as U.S. ambassador will help Canada establish a healthy working
relationship with the Obama administration. We have a number of troubling issues
that need immediate attention: climate change, buy-U.S. protectionist policies and
border security just to name three. Premier Doer is adept at threading his way
through thickets of competing interests, at bringing all sides together and making
everyone feel that they contributed to the final decision. I am delighted with his
appointment.

Premier Gary Doer spent 11 years in opposition before winning the first of three
majority governments in 1999. He drove Manitoba's economic growth with prudent
fiscal management and balanced budgets - each and every year. He made his province
a world leader in renewable energy, supported education and skills training, and
invested in stronger public health care. He is, and will always be, an inspiration
to our party.

Just a few weeks ago, Premier Doer spoke at our National Convention in Halifax, Nova
Scotia. He spoke of the balance between principle and power, saying that winning
government and enacting good, progressive policies was the right thing to do.
Premier Doer and his government stayed true to their principles and made lives
better in every corner of Manitoba.

New Democrats feel honoured to have one of our most effective leaders chosen to play
this significant role on behalf all Canadians. On behalf of our caucus in Ottawa and
New Democrats across Canada, I wish my friend Gary and his wife Ginny well in this
new opportunity to serve Canada.

M. Spector M. Spector's picture

Aparently Layton imagines that Harper has nothing to say about relations with the Obomba administration.

kevsin@sasktel.net

    Rather amusing that Doer takes patronage appiontment after being at Fed. NDP Halifax Convention.No mention of his patronage plum there and him pontificating on his high social Democratic principles (liberal democrat).Must be nice how they can forget their democratic socialist values so easily as long as they have a paycheque.Even though he could live on his pension from being MLA and then Premier.I agree with Unionist that insulting Seniors by referring to Seniors watching soaps is an insult.Maybe he perceives that's what unemployed workers do also.When the job market is full of service jobs at Burger King and Mcdonalds,no job creation strategy.

   Now I know why I didn't stick around to hear his speech at NDP Convention,same old rhetoric from Gary.Don't do what i do but do what I say.Further, no future in Fed. politics now I would assert,kind of like being put out to pasture but with perks and patronage.Representing Harper Neo-Con. Gov't. in Washington.What a sell-out !

    Does he view this as a way of promoting social democratic values ? Doesn't add up and he always was kind of a clown in a suit.Always big smile even in times of restraint or tough economic issues.He knows how the Tories and Liberals practice politics and in this case " capitalizes" on this knowledge.If that isn't a sell-out what is ??

Frustrated Mess Frustrated Mess's picture

M. Spector wrote:

Interesting to see how the political elite of the NDP slide so effortlessly into serving the political elites of the capitalist class.

And party members aren't even embarrassed!

And suddenly serving the Harper regime's agenda --preventing international agreement on climate change, promoting tar sands, selling out softwood, militarizing the Arctic, troops wherever America wants them, harmonization, more free trade that protects investors but neither workers nor environment, etc, etc ...- ain't really all that bad.

 

George Victor

 

Of course some of us are embarassed, MS, as I said in another thread. This has been going on since Stephen Lewis.  Don't pigeon-hole the world, please, in your apparent need to categorize and label folks. Just keep the statistics of poverty coming.

Of course Harper has done this for political gain. That's obvious. Now to see if it plays out in the fashion that FM has described. It's the threatened defence of Canada's Tar Patch that hurts most.

And there is still the need to keep our bastard PM from a majority. I'm tempted to say that we now have a bastard ambassador not helping in that regard.

Unionist

M. Spector wrote:

Interesting to see how the political elite of the NDP slide so effortlessly into serving the political elites of the capitalist class.

And party members aren't even embarrassed!

You know, I'm willing to bet a whole lot of them in Manitoba will be embarrassed - the same lot who have been biting their tongue (or speaking out) for years against this neo-liberal regime and its behaviour. I just wish those people of conscience were a bit better represented here.

 

Frustrated Mess Frustrated Mess's picture

Dewar has always been a big supporter of Harper's Arctic agenda (militarize and open to corporate pillaging) including Manitoba's north. It is actually a very good fit for Harper. It also points to the reason that I consider myself a political orphan.

N.Beltov N.Beltov's picture

Premier Doer's endless and nauseating "support of the troops" mantra did a great service ... for Gary Doer.

Who knew it was a career move? I thought it was just an effort to steal votes from the right wing.

George Victor

 

Please, not the Superior Conscience line.   Some of us mere mortals struggle valiantly to rise to the call.

genstrike

Unionist wrote:
You know, I'm willing to bet a whole lot of them in Manitoba will be embarrassed - the same lot who have been biting their tongue (or speaking out) for years against this neo-liberal regime and its behaviour. I just wish those people of conscience were a bit better represented here.

Remember, if Gary Doer ever becomes as big of a pariah as Bob Rae - I hated Gary Doer on babble before it was cool.

 

M. Spector wrote:
Interesting to see how the political elite of the NDP slide so effortlessly into serving the political elites of the capitalist class.

And party members aren't even embarrassed!

This isn't a slide, Doer has always served the political elites of the capitalist class as premier.

Perhaps this will finally put to rest the notion of the NDP as a "working class party" that infests certain sections of the radical left.

N.Beltov N.Beltov's picture

I genuinely found the whole "pro-war" crap from Doer repulsive at the time. He was undermining the anti-war and peace movement. As Stockholm (sort of) pointed out on the other thread, objecting to my bringing in foreign policy matters into provincial politics, foreign policy hardly belongs to the public utterances of a provincial premier. Doer did it anway.

We now know that, not only did such statements hurt the peace movement, undoubtedly reducing the NDP contingent in the shrinking peace walks and such, but also has undoubtedly helped Doer get his new job.

Since when does it take an immortal to be a peacenik? You're setting the bar way too low, George.

 

Unionist

[url=High">http://network.nationalpost.com/np/blogs/fullcomment/archive/2009/08/28/... praise for Doer[/url] from the Nazionalische Post:

Quote:
In practice the "Third Way" is usually just a mess of contradictions and ad-hoc arrangements, and Doer's record proved it in certain ways. One only needs to look at his long journey from excoriating U. S.-Canada free trade in 1998 to crying out for the "defence" of NAFTA against "Buy American" policies in 2009. [...]

On key files ranging from health care to public utilities, Mr. Doer was a doctrinaire socialist [NOTE by Unionist: he forgot to take back the MTS though...]. But he remained idiosyncratic and populist enough to remain a perennial thorn in the side of NDP purists. He was probably the Kyoto Protocol's biggest Canadian defender not named Stephane Dion or David Suzuki, but he supported the Afghan war, opposed the federal firearms registry, and could keep up with anybody when it came to fire-breathing law-and-order talk.  Manitoba's business interests generally found him congenial (especially with regard to tax policies)  [...] He has kept government spending in check, and Manitoba taxes are somewhere between average and low in every way that counts. The future may perhaps regret the relative lack of progress on the conjoined issues of urban crime and First Nations welfare, but no one else has exactly managed to square those circles.

 

 

George Victor

FM:

"Dewar has always been a big supporter of Harper's Arctic agenda (militarize and open to corporate pillaging) including Manitoba's north. It is actually a very good fit for Harper. It also points to the reason that I consider myself a political orphan."

 

Could you not decide to accept the lesser of two (or three) weevils, FM? (Sorry, that's from a Patrick O'Brian novel. Couldn't resist introducing a touch of levity to the tirade).

Boom Boom Boom Boom's picture

derrick wrote:

Statement by New Democrat leader Jack Layton the appointment of Premier Gary Doer of
Manitoba to position as U.S. Ambassador:

 He is, and will always be, an inspiration to our party.

LaughingLaughingLaughingLaughing

Unionist

N.Beltov, please correct your post - you've attributed genstrike's comment to me, and I really don't want to see that particular debate infect this thread until we're done scorning Gary Doer for a while.

 

N.Beltov N.Beltov's picture

OK, whoops. Quotes within quotes and all.

N.Beltov N.Beltov's picture

genstrike wrote:
Perhaps this will finally put to rest the notion of the NDP as a "working class party" that infests certain sections of the radical left.

The labour movement is still well represented in the NDP in this country. Even if the NDPers in the labour movement are on the right wing of the party, the existence of such a party in federal, and provincial, politics, provides Canada with a better political mixture than our unfortunate friends in the USA. This is important and should not be trivialized.

They're a mixed bag of positives and negatives. More importantly, they have the allegiance of huge swaths of the more class conscious workers in this country. Give your head a shake, g.

It's much more educational for workers to see where the NDP goes wrong, and turns away from working people, than to have no NDP at all. Isn't that obvious?

George Victor

"...until we're done scorning Gary Doer for a while."  

Let's see, prostrating oneself does not work, and little jokes fail.  What can he mean by "for a while"?Undecided

scarboroughnative

Way to go Gary.  His appointment is a testament to the fact that when pragmatic, disciplined and rational members of the NDP come to power our party has a chance at appearing credible and can even participate at a high level of influence (ambassador to USA).

This is a triumph of NDP principles. We should be raising this guy on our shoulders and shouting NDP! NDP!

Instead All I'm hearing is a bunch of typical whinning leftie complaints about how he's a sell out for working with the establishment.

Newsflash: your socalist revolution where we knock down the bourgeoise, ain't gonna happen. 

Those who get it actually know that you have to work within the machine to change the machine. 

Go social democracy!

George Victor

"Go social democracy!"

 

Yes, but just where do you think Steve intends it to go, with this move?

N.Beltov N.Beltov's picture

How is the success of an NDP Premier in getting such a plum job thanks, in part, to his noisy pro-war public statements a blow for social democracy? It's a blow for Gary Doer. And, like many before him, he's leaving Manitoba.

Jingles

Quote:
Those who get it actually know that you have to work within the machine to change the machine.

Really? How's that working out for you? 

Please provide one example of "work(ing) within the machine" wherein said machine was changed.

remind remind's picture

N.Beltov wrote:
genstrike wrote:
Perhaps this will finally put to rest the notion of the NDP as a "working class party" that infests certain sections of the radical left.

The labour movement is still well represented in the NDP in this country. Even if the NDPers in the labour movement are on the right wing of the party, the existence of such a party in federal, and provincial, politics, provides Canada with a better political mixture than our unfortunate friends in the USA. This is important and should not be trivialized.

They're a mixed bag of positives and negatives. More importantly, they have the allegiance of huge swaths of the more class conscious workers in this country. Give your head a shake, g.

It's much more educational for workers to see where the NDP goes wrong, and turns away from working people, than to have no NDP at all. Isn't that obvious?

Great way to put it NBeltov.

Bookish Agrarian

Please provide one example of "work(ing) within the machine" wherein said machine was changed.

 

 

 

Public Health Care in Canada - thanks to that sell-out Tommy Douglas.  And yes that is exactly what some of these ancestors of the lily pure theorists called Douglas.  How soon we forget our history.

 

 

Douglas did not attempt public health care in one go.  First he balanced the budget, then he worked incrementally towards fundamental change until there was enough critical mass to resist the reactionary powers against it.

 

 

How soon we forget our history in the drive for some sort of ideological purity that only some small sliver of society would agree with.

NDPP

M. Spector wrote:

Interesting to see how the political elite of the NDP slide so effortlessly into serving the political elites of the capitalist class.

And party members aren't even embarrassed!

NDPP

Rae, Dosanjh, Doer...

"The NDP is a natural habitat for someone like me.."

Ujjal Dosanjh

"A party of the working class, led by the middle class in the interest of the ruling class"

B.L. on the NDP

Frustrated Mess Frustrated Mess's picture

scarboroughnative wrote:

Way to go Gary.  His appointment is a testament to the fact that when pragmatic, disciplined and rational members of the NDP come to power our party has a chance at appearing credible and can even participate at a high level of influence (ambassador to USA).

This is a triumph of NDP principles. We should be raising this guy on our shoulders and shouting NDP! NDP!

Instead All I'm hearing is a bunch of typical whinning leftie complaints about how he's a sell out for working with the establishment.

Newsflash: your socalist revolution where we knock down the bourgeoise, ain't gonna happen. 

Those who get it actually know that you have to work within the machine to change the machine. 

Go social democracy!

I think you meant "Go unfettered free enterprise and on the way screw the environment, the workers, and send our young to foreign lands to kill brown people for big oil!"

N.Beltov wrote:

It's much more educational for workers to see where the NDP goes wrong, and turns away from working people, than to have no NDP at all. Isn't that obvious?

No, the existance of a faux left party giving credibility by progressives and labour stands in the way of the establishment of a true socialist voice and party. Holy crap! How many Obamas, Blairs, Raes, and Doers, do we need before we wipe the crud from our eyes? This all simply underlines my earlier arguments that there really is no left in Canada or the West. There are merely factions of capitalism and some who paint themselves lipstick red.

remind remind's picture

Jingles wrote:
Quote:
Those who get it actually know that you have to work within the machine to change the machine.

Really? How's that working out for you? 

Please provide one example of "work(ing) within the machine" wherein said machine was changed.

medicine

psychology

social work

religion

politics

literature

science

scarboroughnative

It is interesting to note that the biggest NDP success stories tend to be from the ranks of those who occupy the so called right end of the left side of the specturm.   These leaders tend to present as articulate, balanced, fiscally interested, and "normal" public figures.

see: Doer, Douglas, Rae, Dexter, and seemingly Layton.

 WHen the NDP goes for the wacko leftie types (the Hamptons, the Kormos, enviro wackos, the weed smokers who get kicked out of conventions... the train stays way off the tracks in the crazy land of protest oppositional politics where the NDP barks at the media for for soundbyte scraps and always fails to clue in to the Zeitgeist.

Working with the machine, infiltrating its networks and gaining the ear of the ruling class is but one of the strategies that must be employed. Doer's position is a step forward in this effort and establishes credability for NDPers to play key roles in government in the minds of the electorate.

We whould pounce on this public relations oppourtunity to show the flag and promote the NDP brand!  Thanks Gary.

MUN Prof. MUN Prof.'s picture

Harpo must have ran out of hockey coaches and CTV pundnits.

George Victor

I have been getting missives in the mail from Gary (Goodyear) every couple of weeks, telling the Unread just how lucky they are to have him at the helm of the Science/Technology portfolio. You'll remember he's the guy who'll deny Darwin?.  And he's been put in charge of $1 billion bucks to spend over the next five years to seed industrial startup in old Ontario. Do you think we should now add to this sort of triumphal march back into the good graces of a devastated industrial area of more than 10 per cent unemployment by saying that appointment of another Gary was simply another in a series of really really smart moves by Steve?

Do you mix much with the masses, there in scarborough?

A_J

derrick wrote:
Statement by New Democrat leader Jack Layton the appointment of Premier Gary Doer of Manitoba to position as U.S. Ambassador:

We have a number of troubling issues that need immediate attention . . . buy-U.S. protectionist policies . . .

Geez, good thing we'll have Doer in Washington fighting for free-trade with Layton's support.

scarboroughnative

MUN Prof. wrote:

Harpo must have ran out of hockey coaches and CTV pundnits.

 

The illiterate hockey coach from Montreal slays me! A futher break from Ontario by the Harper administration. They missed the boat on that one and could have won acclaim with a pick of Tie Domi. Never underestimate the ease at which the Ontario public can be bought with hockey.

Bookish Agrarian

WHen the NDP goes for the wacko leftie types (the Hamptons, the Kormos, enviro wackos, the weed smokers who get kicked out of conventions... the train stays way off the tracks in the crazy land of protest oppositional politics where the NDP barks at the media for for soundbyte scraps and always fails to clue in to the Zeitgeist.

That's just as dumb ass stupid as thinking you can never work with anyone from other parts of the ideological spectrum in a democracy.

kevsin@sasktel.net

   Comments from Scarboroughnative about "working within the machine to change the machine",are remarks to cover-up the obvious," patronage".Doer will be representing Canadian Gov't.,which is the Harpocrites - Neo-Conservative Gov't..As mentioned earlier about soft-wood lumber deal (loss of 1 Billion dollars),climate-change,war in Afghanistan (American imperialism),tar-sands ( rape,pillage and plunder/pollute),Khadr in Guantanimo,election fraud in last Fed.election( in&out scam),tax-cuts to profitable Banks,failure to reform Employ.Insurance,militarization of the artic,criminalization of the poor,failure to support harm-reduction strategy(war on drugs),Kelowna accord scraped,national child-care and on..........

   Putting this appointment into perspective exhibits certain facts from democractic socialist point of view,that doesn't mean socialist revolution but certainly some principles from the "social democrats",if you consider Doer to be one.We live in a mixed economy that doesn't mean we have to support every trade-deal that comes along from the business elite.That's how we got into this recession and the Harpocrites are spouting the same rhetoric as Bush Doctrine.I acknowledge the Obama Gov't. will be more progressive but so far Obama has been very disappointing.He had support from Labour and Big Business,can he balance the two ? The passing of " free-choices act " will tell if the proof is in the pudding.Also,proposing Public-Private Health Care reform,rather then totally Public ( maybe small steps before going totally public,I don't know).

     Further,Doer will be the mouthpiece for Harpocrities in Washington, does anyone think he will be drafting his own trade policy ? The topic in another board was whether he might move on to Federal politics.I think that assertion has been put to rest.Also,Doer was Corrections officer in a previous life,and many in this rank & file union are pro-military,hence his support for war in Afghanistan.Can't forget your " roots".We've wasted 30 billion dollars in that failed mission and all the innocent people killed (.....it's the Crude Dude ).

George Victor

"Never underestimate the ease at (sic) which the Ontario public can be bought..."

Not with hockey nor anything else, no I never will.

scarboroughnative

Bookish Agrarian wrote:

WHen the NDP goes for the wacko leftie types (the Hamptons, the Kormos, enviro wackos, the weed smokers who get kicked out of conventions... the train stays way off the tracks in the crazy land of protest oppositional politics where the NDP barks at the media for for soundbyte scraps and always fails to clue in to the Zeitgeist.

That's just as dumb ass stupid as thinking you can never work with anyone from other parts of the ideological spectrum in a democracy.

 

Perhaps...but sometimes a little point, counterpoint is needed to illustrate the concept that the NDP is supported by people from all ends of the Left of center spectrum and not just the fringes.

scarboroughnative

Bookish Agrarian wrote:

WHen the NDP goes for the wacko leftie types (the Hamptons, the Kormos, enviro wackos, the weed smokers who get kicked out of conventions... the train stays way off the tracks in the crazy land of protest oppositional politics where the NDP barks at the media for for soundbyte scraps and always fails to clue in to the Zeitgeist.

That's just as dumb ass stupid as thinking you can never work with anyone from other parts of the ideological spectrum in a democracy.

 

Perhaps...but sometimes a little point, counterpoint is needed to illustrate the concept that the NDP is supported by people from all ends of the Left of center spectrum and not just the fringes.

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