Justin Trudeau elbows Ruth Ellen Brosseau

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bekayne

quizzical wrote:

history showed what happened to Joe Clark.

Yes. Nothing.

kropotkin1951 kropotkin1951's picture

Here is a fairly unbiased account of what this event was actually all about.

Quote:

The tail end of Wednesday may have seemed like an errant outburst, but the day began with news that infuriated both major opposition parties.

Item "No. 6" under "Government Business" on the daily order paper was notice of a motion that would make some changes to Parliamentary procedure, including giving the government more control over when the House sits.

Retired House of Commons procedural clerk Thomas Hall told The Tyee the motion would also override some standing orders in the House that opposition parties use to delay legislation from being passed.

For example: members may submit instructions to a Parliamentary committee examining legislation, which in turn will delay the passing of other legislation in the House by forcing a debate and vote on the instructions.

If the motion passes, such tactics wouldn't be available to leverage the government into amending legislation as it goes through the House, said New Democrat House leader Peter Julian to reporters earlier on Wednesday.

"It removes any possibility of the kind of negotiation that takes place in Parliament that Canadians want to see: a negotiation between all parties," Julian said. "That has always been the hallmark of Canadian democracy and this takes away any negotiation at all."

During Question Period, Conservative leader Rona Ambrose said the changes amount to Trudeau wanting "a government and an audience," rather than an opposition.

The Liberals were also embarrassed earlier this week when they barely passed the Air Canada Public Participation Act, needing the vote from the speaker to break a tie to pass the bill.

Some opposition members accused the Liberals of designing the motion in order to prevent such mishaps from happening again.

Exaggeration?

But Government House Leader Dominic LeBlanc said the opposition parties are exaggerating the motion's effect.

LeBlanc said with the extended hours opposition parties will actually have more time to argue for changes to proposed legislation while ensuring bills can't simply be killed through stall tactics.

"All we've said with this motion is that we want to ensure that more members of Parliament are allowed to speak, something that they've asked for continuously," LeBlanc said. "But we also want to ensure some predictability and some certainty that legislation will be able to come to a vote."

So, suffice it to say, tension related to procedure was already permeating throughout the musty halls of Parliament Hill on Wednesday before the brawl broke out.

http://thetyee.ca/News/2016/05/19/Parliamentary-Brawl-101/

 

kropotkin1951 kropotkin1951's picture

Here is Rabble's House correspondent take on the action in the House. 

Quote:

Fighting, or even any sort of physical contact, is not part of the game in the House of Commons.

There should be no need for enforcers in Parliament.

In his supposedly unqualified apology, Justin Trudeau tried to argue that his actions on Wednesday were somehow mitigated by the fact that he was trying to assist the Official Opposition Whip to his seat.

Since when is that the Prime Minister's job? Does the Prime Minister think he is an usher, or, perhaps, the House's bouncer?

Newfoundland Liberal MP Rodger Cuzner gave the lie to that pretention of an honourable motive when, in trying to justify the Prime Minister' s physical intervention, he said: "He wants to get stuff done and the opposition parties have been absolutely non-co-operative."

Trying to "get stuff done" in the face of  "non-co-operative" opposition parties. Sound like a familiar argument?

Parliamentary democracy can be inconvenient, indeed. Stephen Harper used to think so. He lost the election; but did he lose the argument?

http://rabble.ca/blogs/bloggers/karl-nerenberg/2016/05/trudeaus-actions-...

 

Unionist

al-Qa'bong wrote:

Apparently the fuddle doesn't fall far from the duddle.

YES!

I couldn't see how anything good could come out of this incident - but it did!

Great to see you here, al-Q, even if it's under unfortunate circumstances. Many of us are pulling for EM to emerge from its technical difficulties.

Basement Dweller
Geoff

I'm starting to remember why the Liberals got chucked in the first place: arrogance and a sense of entitlement. And for their efforts, we were stuck with Stephen Harper for a decade.

josh

Aristotleded24 wrote:

bekayne wrote:

Aristotleded24 wrote:

The first rule of sexual harassment training is that it's not the intent but the effect that is relevant. 

So grabbing Gordon Brown's arm was sexual harassment?

The whole issue of framing behaviour as intentional or not can allow people to absolve themselves of responsibility by saying it was not their "intention."

And it can result in them being held responsible for something they never intended.

mark_alfred

Ha!  Very good news.  The Liberals have withdrawn their repressive motion!

 

http://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/motion-6-withdrawal-leblanc-1.3589812

ETA:  oh, I see this was posted already.

josh

Did he get 2 mintues?

voice of the damned

Geoff wrote:

I'm starting to remember why the Liberals got chucked in the first place: arrogance and a sense of entitlement. And for their efforts, we were stuck with Stephen Harper for a decade.

Funny though, that Chretien's mauling of that LEFT-WING demonstrator didn't do the party much harm in terms of public popularity, even among its progressive supporters, with Cretien winning two more elections after that, and then Martin squeezing out a minority in 2003.

Debater

Caissa wrote:

The NDP Mps were clearly blocking the Conservatie Whip. As an NDP member, I am ashamed of the behaviour of my party.

True.

The behaviour of everyone was childish.  As the video shows, the NDP MPs were blocking the Con Whip, and it looks like Mulcair was also taking part.

As for Trudeau, he should not have gone over to intervene.  He should have stayed in his seat.

But it's obvious that he didn't intentionally elbow REB.

Some of the NDP MPs, especially Niki Ashton, have been trying to compare this event to spousal assault, and the NDP MPs are now getting a lot of blowback on Twitter from women who are angry at the way the NDP is portraying this.

jjuares

Debater wrote:

Caissa wrote:

The NDP Mps were clearly blocking the Conservatie Whip. As an NDP member, I am ashamed of the behaviour of my party.

True.

The behaviour of everyone was childish.  As the video shows, the NDP MPs were blocking the Con Whip, and it looks like Mulcair was also taking part.

As for Trudeau, he should not have gone over to intervene.  He should have stayed in his seat.

But it's obvious that he didn't intentionally elbow REB.

Some of the NDP MPs, especially Niki Ashton, have been trying to compare this event to spousal assault, and the NDP MPs are now getting a lot of blowback on Twitter from women who are angry at the way the NDP is portraying this.


Liberal operatives are very active on all social media. The fact remains that Trudeau grabbed the Tory MP telling everyone to get the fuck out of his way. The elbow was accidental. However, when you go barging into a crowd mad as hell determined to use physical means shit happens. I am ashamed of not only Trudeau but all these Liberal hacks defending him. As one on this site said about her she is a former barmaid. The Liberal social media army has posted some ugly things today.

mark_alfred

Indeed.  Did the Liberal-apologists not get the memo?  Trudeau himself says, "It was my mistake," and wants to make amends.

http://www.ctvnews.ca/politics/it-was-my-mistake-trudeau-wants-to-make-a...

Debater

Yes, Trudeau apologized several times.  It's a good sign that he's willing to admit a mistake.

And obviously the 'barmaid' comment above about REB was stupid & unacceptable.

But the fact remains that there are many women who are genuinely offended at the way the NDP is trying to compare the accidental elbow with spousal abuse.

jjuares

Debater wrote:

Yes, Trudeau apologized several times.  It's a good sign that he's willing to admit a mistake.

And obviously the 'barmaid' comment above about REB was stupid & unacceptable.

But the fact remains that there are many women who are genuinely offended at the way the NDP is trying to compare the accidental elbow with spousal abuse.


Well, the Liberals are trying to make lemonade of the lemon that Trudeau just handed them.

quizzical

i think the minimizing by Liberals and by those who were suckered into voting for them again is the only thing equal to spousal assault situations.

kropotkin1951 kropotkin1951's picture

Debater wrote:

But the fact remains that there are many women who are genuinely offended at the way the NDP is trying to compare the accidental elbow with spousal abuse.

Does your crystal ball tell you whether that is more or less than the number off woman offended by his elbowing her in the first place? 

 

quizzical

if i was a believer in skilled button pushing i think i would see a masterfully played plan with intended results accomplished through backroom bargaining.

Quote:
Government House Leader Dominic LeBlanc has announced the Liberals will withdraw a controversial motion to limit debate in the House of Commons...

Late Tuesday, LeBlanc filed notice of a motion that, if adopted, would let Trudeau's cabinet extend sitting hours in the House until a minister or parliamentary secretary decides to adjourn proceedings, something that would be "deemed adopted without debate or amendment."

In effect, this move, referred to as motion six, would allow Liberals to control Commons debate. The tactic followed days of acrimony as Trudeau's government struggled to advance priority legislation...

...Opposition Leader Rona Ambrose led off Thursday's question period by saying that Prime Minister Justin Trudeau's temper got the better of him on Wednesday night and said it was an extension of the way he's treating the House...

After question period, debate collapsed and the Commons referred the matter of privilege to the Commons procedure and House affairs committee for further study and recommendations.

http://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/motion-6-withdrawal-leblanc-1.3589812

Pondering

I think the NDP was trying to physically obstruct the business of the house by preventing other MPs from taking their seats.

I think Trudeau should not have taken the MP's arm but it was not an attack. Brosseau was behind him. If the man in front of me in the Metro accidently elbows me as we are getting on or off, and I'm behind him, I am not going to call any kind of assault sexual or otherwise.

Arthur is right. The public is going to blame the NDP for the entire incident. Just like many of us think that Conservatives lie and fight dirty, people are going to start to think the same of the NDP. That the NDP is using smear tactics and procedural tricks to impede or obstruct the proper workings of parliament.

I am particularly disappointed in Ashton. She is obviously trying to make a name for her self to vie for the leadership. Trade deals, the Leap, Bay Street, none of that deserves as much attention as this incident in the eyes of the NDP because beating Trudeau is the NDP's primary goal not defending and helping Canadians fight the 1%. Because of that they are doomed to failure because the NDP is just a less professional liberal party with a toe testing the water on the left side to fish for votes.

quizzical

an apologist for violence now pondering.

jjuares

.......

Aristotleded24

Debater wrote:
Caissa wrote:

The NDP Mps were clearly blocking the Conservatie Whip. As an NDP member, I am ashamed of the behaviour of my party.

True.

The behaviour of everyone was childish.  As the video shows, the NDP MPs were blocking the Con Whip, and it looks like Mulcair was also taking part.

As for Trudeau, he should not have gone over to intervene.  He should have stayed in his seat.

But it's obvious that he didn't intentionally elbow REB.

Some of the NDP MPs, especially Niki Ashton, have been trying to compare this event to spousal assault, and the NDP MPs are now getting a lot of blowback on Twitter from women who are angry at the way the NDP is portraying this.

Pondering wrote:

I think the NDP was trying to physically obstruct the business of the house by preventing other MPs from taking their seats.

I think Trudeau should not have taken the MP's arm but it was not an attack. Brosseau was behind him. If the man in front of me in the Metro accidently elbows me as we are getting on or off, and I'm behind him, I am not going to call any kind of assault sexual or otherwise.

Arthur is right. The public is going to blame the NDP for the entire incident. Just like many of us think that Conservatives lie and fight dirty, people are going to start to think the same of the NDP. That the NDP is using smear tactics and procedural tricks to impede or obstruct the proper workings of parliament.

I am particularly disappointed in Ashton. She is obviously trying to make a name for her self to vie for the leadership. Trade deals, the Leap, Bay Street, none of that deserves as much attention as this incident in the eyes of the NDP because beating Trudeau is the NDP's primary goal not defending and helping Canadians fight the 1%. Because of that they are doomed to failure because the NDP is just a less professional liberal party with a toe testing the water on the left side to fish for votes.

This is absolutely ridiculous. The Commons can be quite a crowded place when MPs are moving to their seats to vote, so that kind of crowd isn't anything new. Trudeau should be used to that by now. If he legitimately felt that anyone was obstructing Commons business, then it is up to the Speaker or the Seargent at Arms to deal with this, not individual MPs. This was absolutely not acceptable behaviour by Trudeau. Period. I find it particularly galling that the Liberal partisans on this thread have minimized Trudeau's behaviour and yet were complaining about how bad Harper was as a government. Funny, I don't remember Harper or his MPs physically assaulting opposition MPs in this manner, if this ever happened, perhaps you can point that out. I also find it distressing that someone who presents herself as a strong feminist is minimizing Trudeau's behaviour using the "she asked for it" defense.

Such a shameful decline in political discourse. I thought that some forms of behaviour were wrong on principle, but I guess it's okay if the person doing it is on your team. In the mean time, poverty continues to plague the nation and Santa's workshop keeps melting. No wonder larger numbers of people are tuning out of politics altogether.

I will give Harper credit for agreeing with Layton on raising the standard of conduct of MPs just after the 2011 election.

mark_alfred

Seems Pondering didn't get the memo I referred to in post #63.

Pondering wrote:

I think the NDP was trying to physically obstruct the business of the house by preventing other MPs from taking their seats.

I think Trudeau should not have taken the MP's arm but it was not an attack. Brosseau was behind him. If the man in front of me in the Metro accidently elbows me as we are getting on or off, and I'm behind him, I am not going to call any kind of assault sexual or otherwise.

Arthur is right. The public is going to blame the NDP for the entire incident. Just like many of us think that Conservatives lie and fight dirty, people are going to start to think the same of the NDP. That the NDP is using smear tactics and procedural tricks to impede or obstruct the proper workings of parliament.

Utter nonsense. It was the draconian motion-6 by the government to limit debate in the House of Commons that led to tensions (and this draconian motion is opposed by all the opposition, including E. May) that caused the "entire incident". And the idea that Trudeau was coming to assist Brown because the NDP was preventing him taking his seat is ridiculous -- Brown could easily have sidestepped the group to the left if he had wanted to -- and no Con is thanking Trudeau for his 'assistance' (IE, for his manhandling of Brown).

No.  And only the most ignorant troll would make such a suggestion.  The fact is, Trudeau's government recklessly left the passing of their abysmal bill C-14, the Physician Assisted Dying Bill (that frankly makes it next to impossible to seek assisted suicide -- it's quite repressive and many don't think it abides by the Carter decision), to the last minute AND then they cut off debate on this important bill! So Trudeau freaks out and acts like a bouncer! That is what caused this incident.

Fortunately, as mentioned earlier, Trudeau has apologized and hopefully seen the error of his ways.  Hopefully there will be no more stifling debate, omnibus bills, draconian motions, and physically manhandling people by the PM or his cronies, so that a decent session in parliament can be possible.  But for this to occur, the government must stop acting as if it's within their right to rule by fiat. 

And when governments do begin to act autocratic and not respect the feedback or ideas of opposition (stifling it instead via omnibus bills and the like), then, well, the NDP have long used procedural methods to strive for our ideals. Remember that one of Layton's last acts was to lead his newly minted team into a filibuster to protest the government's handling of Canada Post. Activism for social justice is the NDP way.

We can all thank the NDP for their action against this unreasonable government.  There has been a huge victory, and that is that the government is shelving its anti-democratic motion-6. Hopefully things will get better in parliament.

http://www.ndp.ca/news/ndp-forces-reversal-liberal-power-grab

Stockholm

I nominate "pondering" for an award for HYPOCRITE OF THE YEAR

6079_Smith_W

mark_alfred wrote:

We can all thank the NDP for their action against this unreasonable government.

I don't. Just because Justin committed the worst offense and wound up blinking doesn't changed the fact all parties are behaving shamefully here.

 

Misfit Misfit's picture

This is what happens when you elect a bouncer as PM.

Misfit Misfit's picture

I don't think Peter Kent apprecisted being called a piece of shit by Trudeau a few years back either. Same scope, same mentality. Oh, and the invasion of Crimea because the Russians lost in hockey, that was priceless too. I could go on, but this is not the first gaffe and it won't be his last either. This grabbing incident was a first in Canadian Parliamentary history.

Aristotleded24

6079_Smith_W wrote:

mark_alfred wrote:

We can all thank the NDP for their action against this unreasonable government.

I don't. Just because Justin committed the worst offense and wound up blinking doesn't changed the fact all parties are behaving shamefully here.

No Smith, they did not. Trudeau physically assaulted members of the Opposition. It's that simple.

Misfit Misfit's picture

When the Prime Minister prides himself of being a boxing expert and needs a boxing match with Brasseau to prove his expertise, and that he was a bouncer in a bar previously, this physical altercation with the Conservative MP and collaterally with REB is more serious than what the pundits are portraying it as being. On his recent trip to the U.S., he needed a photo op of himself sparring in a boxing ring. This was an impulsive, anger driven, temper tantrum, and a clear statement of power over others. He has also been accused of rolling his eyes, making faces at the opposition, and of sticking out his tongue while the House is in session. This is NOT behaviour becoming of the Prime Minister of Canada. Oh, and whip out the CF-18's? He clearly lacks the maturity that is required for the job.

White Cat White Cat's picture

Funny watching Con and NDP partisans trying to milk this thing for all they can get. Seems the harder they try, the less milk comes out.

Although things got out of hand, I actually like the passionate side of Trudeau. Like when he called Peter Kent a piece of shit. Why? Kent blocked opposition parties from going to a climate summit then scolded them for being climate slackers for not showing up.

Hopefully these Dipper obstructionist politicians will give Trudeau some elbow room in his bid to make Canada a democracy. (I know they already got the knives out eager to cut off their noses to spite their faces and score some more political points on their own goal.)

P.S.: Fuddle duddle! (Just had to say it. ;)

Misfit Misfit's picture

Thank goodness and cudos to the NDP for being able to expose Trudeau for what he really is.

White Cat White Cat's picture

BTW, Ruth Ellen Brosseau reminds me of Slippin' Jimmy from Better Call Saul. He would go into a grocery store, pour a thing of milk on the floor, then take a big fall and sue the place. Slippin' Ruth tried to get behind Trudeau thinking he'd bump into her which she could use to make a big deal of. Looks like she got more than she bargained for! 

Misfit Misfit's picture

Make Canada a democracy by stifling debate in the House of Commons which pissed of even Elizabeth May? Then fuddle duddle to your version of democracy! There were over 100 opposition MPs affected by Peter Kent's stunt, yet only one MP lost his cool and shouted obscenities in the House of Commons. Junior is not fit for the job.

Misfit Misfit's picture

Your last post is beneath even you.

jjuares

White Cat wrote:

BTW, Ruth Ellen Brosseau reminds me of Slippin' Jimmy from Better Call Saul. He would go into a grocery store, pour a thing of milk on the floor, then take a big fall and sue the place. Slippin' Ruth tried to get behind Trudeau thinking he'd bump into her which she could use to make a big deal of. Looks like she got more than she bargained for! 


She tried to get in behind Trudeau so she could get hit? In other words she was asking for it. Hey, you remind me of a misogynist.

jjuares

Misfit wrote:
Your last post is beneath even you.

No, it's not. It is typical of what I am see of the Liberals the last few days. For this poster it is business as usual.

White Cat White Cat's picture

Misfit wrote:
Make Canada a democracy by stifling debate in the House of Commons which pissed of even Elizabeth May? Fuddle duddle to your version of democracy! There were over 100 opposition MPs affected by Peter Kent's stunt, yet only one MP lost his cool and shouted obscenities in the House of Commons. Junior is not fit for the job.

I don't fall for all this PC outrage bullshit. What Peter Kent said was a million more times offensive than what Trudeau said. Trudeau was right for calling Kent a piece of shit. He said what needed to be said.

I'm not a fan of Trudeau's Red Tory economic and environmental policies. But as long as we have FPTP, the Liberals will have to split the Red Tory vote to prevent a Con government on 35% of the vote, which would obviously be much worse. 

I like that Trudeau is more like a regular guy than a gasbag lawyer-politician who might debate what the meaning of the word 'is' is. Fuddle duddle decorum and establishment politicians! (Especially Mulcair.)

White Cat White Cat's picture

jjuares wrote:
White Cat wrote:

BTW, Ruth Ellen Brosseau reminds me of Slippin' Jimmy from Better Call Saul. He would go into a grocery store, pour a thing of milk on the floor, then take a big fall and sue the place. Slippin' Ruth tried to get behind Trudeau thinking he'd bump into her which she could use to make a big deal of. Looks like she got more than she bargained for! 

She tried to get in behind Trudeau so she could get hit? In other words she was asking for it. Hey, you remind me of a misogynist.

LOL. More PC outrage bullshit. My hypothesis is that she got right behind Trudeau hoping he would bump into her then she could fall down or something and make a big scene out of it. But she got too close to the commotion and got elbowed. This is based on the reality that NDP politicians caused the whole scene with their obstructionist games.

So she wasn't 'asking for it.' She got a whole lot more than what she was asking for! (If she had been a male, she would've known better, from experience, than to get that close to an altercation.)

BTW, I'm not a Liberal. Partisans of all stripes get on my nerves. I think they're all full of crap.

Aristotleded24

White Cat wrote:
Hopefully these Dipper obstructionist politicians will give Trudeau some elbow room in his bid to make Canada a democracy. (I know they already got the knives out eager to cut off their noses to spite their faces and score some more political points on their own goal.)

So the latest Liberal spin is that the NDP somehow orchestrated this by preventing a Conservative MP from returning to his seat and forcing Trudeau to come over there? Gosh that is pathetic! And how is it that a party which can't get its act together during the most crucial campaign of its existence is suddenly powerful enough to deliberately orchestrate something like this.

White Cat White Cat's picture

Aristotleded24 wrote:

White Cat wrote:
Hopefully these Dipper obstructionist politicians will give Trudeau some elbow room in his bid to make Canada a democracy. (I know they already got the knives out eager to cut off their noses to spite their faces and score some more political points on their own goal.)

So the latest Liberal spin is that the NDP somehow orchestrated this by preventing a Conservative MP from returning to his seat and forcing Trudeau to come over there? Gosh that is pathetic! And how is it that a party which can't get its act together during the most crucial campaign of its existence is suddenly powerful enough to deliberately orchestrate something like this.

LOL. Some guy makes a frank comment and suddenly he's a Liberal operative. Talk about spin!

Mulcair was obviously pressing Trudeau's buttons playing obstructionist games. Probably didn't expect Trudeau come right over and try to handle the matter in person. But you can see Mulcair was very satisfied with the outcome, letting slip a big wide evil grin.

Aristotleded24

White Cat wrote:
Mulcair was obviously pressing Trudeau's buttons playing obstructionist games. Probably didn't expect Trudeau come right over and try to handle the matter in person. But you can see Mulcair was very satisfied with the outcome, letting slip a big wide evil grin.

Even if you accept the notion that Mulcair was playing political games, Trudeau himself made the choice to come over and handle it himself, rather than alert the Speaker. Alerting the Speaker is proper House protocol. Seriously, this excuse sounds exactly like a child saying, "he made me do it" after hitting someone else.

What's your explanation for the fact that the Conservative MP in question specifically complained about Trudeau and never said anything about NDP MPs blocking his path?

White Cat White Cat's picture

Aristotleded24 wrote:

White Cat wrote:
Mulcair was obviously pressing Trudeau's buttons playing obstructionist games. Probably didn't expect Trudeau come right over and try to handle the matter in person. But you can see Mulcair was very satisfied with the outcome, letting slip a big wide evil grin.

Even if you accept the notion that Mulcair was playing political games, Trudeau himself made the choice to come over and handle it himself, rather than alert the Speaker. Alerting the Speaker is proper House protocol. Seriously, this excuse sounds exactly like a child saying, "he made me do it" after hitting someone else.

What's your explanation for the fact that the Conservative MP in question specifically complained about Trudeau and never said anything about NDP MPs blocking his path?

Trudeau clearly made a mistake. But, in my opinion, it was an honest mistake. I much prefer a politician who's susceptible to losing their cool than scheming lawyer-politician who's trained to lie for a living.

I think the jury is still out on whether or not Trudeau is another fake liberal sellout. He has big plans and has only been in power 7 months. So although I've been very critical of Trudeau in the past, I'm willing to give him some time to reveal his true colors.

(If anything, this incident has given me a more favorable impression of Trudeau. An image-focused Machiavellian politician would never have taken the bait.)

 

Pondering

Aristotleded24 wrote:

White Cat wrote:
Mulcair was obviously pressing Trudeau's buttons playing obstructionist games. Probably didn't expect Trudeau come right over and try to handle the matter in person. But you can see Mulcair was very satisfied with the outcome, letting slip a big wide evil grin.

Even if you accept the notion that Mulcair was playing political games, Trudeau himself made the choice to come over and handle it himself, rather than alert the Speaker. Alerting the Speaker is proper House protocol. Seriously, this excuse sounds exactly like a child saying, "he made me do it" after hitting someone else.

What's your explanation for the fact that the Conservative MP in question specifically complained about Trudeau and never said anything about NDP MPs blocking his path?

If any of it stuck it would be to the benefit of the Conservatives and the NDP if Trudeau were damaged by this. I saw the video, I didn't see anyone getting assaulted. This doesn't even compare to Rob Ford knocking down that elderly woman. Was it inappropriate? Sure, I will give you that, and if that was all the criticism he was getting a lot of people would probably agree. The reason it is backfiring is the exageration and dramatic accusations. The NDP is more upset about this than they are about the actual bill.

Yes there are times when extreme measures are valid but the issue has to be rare otherwise it's just being obstructionist for the sake of it. You can keep defending the NDP but you cannot argue that this is helping the NDP or Canadians. If anything this kerfuffle will damage NDP numbers. Certainly there are times a party should put principles ahead of electibility but this isn't one of them. This is just crappy strategy.

The bill isn't going to be changed or stopped on the NDP's say so. By 2019 there will be people who have to commit suicide rather than wait for dementia or MS or ALS to claim their atonomy. The lack of advance directive guts the bill for those who need it the most. I am all for strict safety measure and for it be limited to people with a terminal condition or irreversible suffering. That isn't murder or suicide it's managed death. The NDP should be on record as opposing the bill with specifics on how they would change it. Then in 2019 they can point out the people that are suffering due to the Liberals failing to come up with an effective law.

The problem isn't that the NDP doesn't play politics it's that they play it so poorly. They don't seem to have any clue on how regular people who are not into politics are going to percieve their actions. The NDP is shooting blind. Watch the polls. I doubt they can drop much farther. I think the NDP is already down to its base but I also doubt that they will rise or that Trudeau's numbers will drop.

Eventually Trudeau's crown will be tarnished but the longer the NDP keeps up the dramatic attacks the better off Trudeau is because it makes the NDP look ridiculous and gets everyone who currently supports Trudeau defending him.

Every headline that starts with "The Conservatives and the NDP" helps Trudeau unless the NDP is going after Conservative votes.

 

lagatta

This statement by Pondering is false and utterly ahistorical:

the NDP is just a less professional liberal party with a toe testing the water on the left side to fish for votes.

Do I think that the NDP needs a better programme and more forthright, socialist leadership? (No, I don't mean that caucus). Yes, of course. But its origins and purpose are utterly different from those of the Liberals.

I'm not an NDP member, but it is the only Federal party I've ever voted for.

There have been some pretty vicious accusations against RE Brosseau, Niki Ashton and in other supposedly "progressive" Liberal blogs, against Alexandre Boulerice. The idea that Ruth Ellen would deliberately set herself up for a painful jab in the boobs (men, think kick in the balls) is very insulting indeed.

jjuares

White Cat wrote:

jjuares wrote:
White Cat wrote:

BTW, Ruth Ellen Brosseau reminds me of Slippin' Jimmy from Better Call Saul. He would go into a grocery store, pour a thing of milk on the floor, then take a big fall and sue the place. Slippin' Ruth tried to get behind Trudeau thinking he'd bump into her which she could use to make a big deal of. Looks like she got more than she bargained for! 

She tried to get in behind Trudeau so she could get hit? In other words she was asking for it. Hey, you remind me of a misogynist.

LOL. More PC outrage bullshit. My hypothesis is that she got right behind Trudeau hoping he would bump into her then she could fall down or something and make a big scene out of it. But she got too close to the commotion and got elbowed. This is based on the reality that NDP politicians caused the whole scene with their obstructionist games.

So she wasn't 'asking for it.' She got a whole lot more than what she was asking for! (If she had been a male, she would've known better, from experience, than to get that close to an altercation.)

BTW, I'm not a Liberal. Partisans of all stripes get on my nerves. I think they're all full of crap.


Oh, I see. She wasn't asking for it, she wanted a physical altercation just not the type off hit she received. You see that as not asking for it? And of course " if she had been a male she would have know better..". More sexist and misogynistic bullshit.

NorthReport

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NorthReport

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Geoff

If Stephen Harper had done what Justin did, all the Liberal apologists who are now claiming that the incident has been 'overblown' would be demanding that Harper be arrested for attempted murder. Trudeau's actions demonstrate that, indeed, the apple doesn't fall far from the tree. 

voice of the damned

White Cat wrote:

P.S.: Fuddle duddle! (Just had to say it. ;)

 

Since you're so keen on referencing a certain 1970s political figure...

http://tinyurl.com/zff6y39

 

 

 

montrealer58 montrealer58's picture

All Canadian Solipsism Central. All The Time.

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